What Happened to Due Process?

Justice is a two way street.  Sometimes getting there is not an easy endeavor. When any victim has to testify against their accuser it can be brutal and oftentimes the victim is re-victimized as a result.  That being said, defendants in this country are guaranteed certain legal procedural rights, and one of them is the right to face their accuser.  It says so in the Constitution so I’m not just making this up.  In the Steubenville case, subpoenas were issued to juveniles living across the river in West Virginia.  One of the subpoenas was issued for  Jane Doe.  I think my confusion here is — shouldn’t the state have issued a subpoena to her?  And if not, perhaps this is why Mr. Madison was compelled to do so.  I’m not an attorney, but I would think that her testimony is essential for BOTH sides of this case.

On Friday Hancock County Judge Ronald Wilson rejected the subpoena requests and  cited no legal case from anywhere in the country to support the argument that the three West Virginia juveniles could be compelled to testify but stated in his 4-page ruling that Ohio and West Virginia law differ in their comparisons of a juvenile delinquency proceeding and a criminal trial.

“The proceeding in Ohio is not a criminal action — it is not a criminal prosecution — and it is not a criminal proceeding.”

Wilson added that there is no law his court follows which gives him the right to honor the Ohio request for the subpoenas.  How does this not create a legal conundrum because Mr. Madison’s client has a constitutional right that is being denied him?

Madison said that the victim’s testimony was central to his client’s case and would involve her recollection of her actions before and after the incident, including what she told hospital staff, her friends and a text messages she sent to one of the accused boys after the incident.

“My client has a constitutional right to confront his accuser,” Madison said. “He has to have the right to call witnesses on his behalf.”

With regard to the text messages that Jane Doe allegedly sent –  it has been discovered through social media that her phone went missing for a few days.  Translation: She did not have possession of her cell phone.  I have many questions.  Questions that started me on this journey for the truth back in August.  Here are a few that come to mind with the news of denying the subpoenas.

  • What date did the text message allegedly sent from Jane Doe take place?
  • Is it possible that Trent Mays may have sent the text himself?
  • How would anyone be able to prove that this occurred since it is rumored that no phone records/ping info or social media was subpoenaed?
  • What is it that was told to hospital staff and could this information  implicate others?

I agree with Mr. Madison.  Both defendants have the right to confront their accuser as well as call witnesses on their behalf and if it is true that other witnesses are going to invoke their Fifth Amendment right not to incriminate themselves to avoid prosecution – how will this affect the entire trial?

 

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394 Comments

  1. CouldBe

    Blerg!
    The continued ridiculousness that comes spewing out of Steubenville short circuits my brain.
    “The ….. in Ohio is not a criminal procedure blah blerg blah” is patently false, a big fat lie and bullshit. No one is suing for damages to their Buick. In fact, NO ONE is suing NO ONE. THE STATE OF OHIO has the dubious honor of laying out rape charges. That’s it. CRIMINAL CHARGES. If convicted, the criminal will not be assessed with financial damages (not in this proceeding anyway), if convicted the rapist will be sentenced. To prison.
    Moving on, people testify across state lines every day. Especially in this area. Oh, Ky, In, WVA, TN and Va all have agencies that regularly work together in every aspect of law enforcement and criminal justice. These six states are tied together tightly when it comes to criminal behavior, so I am sorta ticked that lawyers are making statements like it would be just outrageous for this young woman to testify! She’s in West Virginia!
    How far is she from Steubenville? An hour, max?
    As I’ve mentioned before, I cant begin to say how horrified and insane I would be if this happened to my daughter. Frankly if any of my daughters ever are victims of violent crime, be prepared to write lots of letters to me while I serve out my life in the hoosegow.
    I have no faith in the criminal justice system, I hope my faith in humanity is held up and collectively Steubenville and all of Ohio do the right thing.
    I am so proud of my town, we just rec’d another commendation from the state regarding our excellent school system, and it’s a miracle. We are a town just like Steubenville. Economy has done a number on mostly everyone, lifestyles have been irrevocably changed, but we have managed to work together to create a school system rated Excellent by the state of Ohio. I like to think that this cant happen here.
    But it can. It can happen anywhere. To anyone’s daughter. Please remember that when you are attacking people who are only interested in shining a light on the truth.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Weirton is less than 10 minutes across the river, and I would be interested in how many other juvenile subpoenas have been honored in the past. I’m not saying that there is something fishy going on, but I just don’t see how this could be the FIRST juvi subpoena to cross state jurisdictions. And again, how can the state even have a case with no witness to testify on their behalf? They have made it a point that this case would not be tried by “the social media” according to DeWine and on evidence, but don’t they need a witness to testify? Has anyone ever heard of a rape trial with no victim presence?

      Reply
  2. ssrugervaquero

    You are confusing CRIMINAL ADULT charges with JUVENILE proceedings. That’s why it was such a travesty the case was remanded to juvenile court. I’ll give you an example….a juvenile 17 year old is CONVICTED of burglary. Him and two adults were breaking into houses and stealing items. The adults went to jail for 18 months. The juvenile got 18 months house arrest and weekends in a juvenile detention center. Due to the weekend incarceration a his sports participation was nil. The parents displeased with this separated and one parent took the other to Texas and enrolled him in an academy. The state tried to have him extradited back to face probation violation charges. Due to him being a juvenile the state of Texas said NO. He was not a criminal therefore he was off limits. Juvenile charges have an entire different set of rules that are meant to protect juveniles from excessive punishment. This case is going to stink no matter the verdict.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Right, I totally understand that a juvenile proceeding is a “delinquency” proceeding and not considered a criminal one because the whole point of a juvenile court system is not to punish so much as to attempt to rehabilitate so that the kid can (hopefully) go on to become a decent member of society and not end up back in the adult criminal system, BUT…aren’t juveniles entitled to the same right to due process as you or I?

      Reply
      1. Aaron

        The accuser is the State of Ohio. The accuser will be in the courtroom. She’s not testifying because of all the media attention…thanks to you and Anonymous.

        Reply
        1. BooBoo

          Aaron you have no idea if JD will be testifying. You’re just pissed that this case got national attention. For that, many people in Steubenville are very thankful! Also I would venture a guess with the knowledge of a second video showing the victim naked with semen on her, I am willing to bet the DOJ is there to look into Steubenville and what Hanlin did or didn’t do. No doubt the reason why Frank Bruzzese, Jane Hanlin and the rest of his law firm are following all the haters on Twitter. It also makes me believe that Bruzzese is the one funding the rape fetish pornography Stranny. They tried to cover up the second video by throwing out crap on others. Too bad it came out!

          Reply
        2. prinnie (Post author)

          She IS testifying. Stop with the blame laying. That’s kind of how we all got to this point to begin with — ya think?

          Reply
  3. C Morgan

    I added a couple comments on the other page regarding… I saw this after doing oops. Another link added, bc the original one would not produce (likely my error!). It had a little more substance.
    My first thought was the 3 were the BFF referenced by a certain (fruity) mom, the ones claimed would be testifying against JD?
    Criminal vs. civil rules of subpoenas applied & assumed here.
    Different due process by defense over state lines… Granting JD a witness of the state, and the victim who filed the original complaint.
    But I suggested, and then just did present some of questions re. To Harold (: on his devoted blog comments. I asked it be considered if the defendant regarding, was more of a scapegoat in case, has any relevance too.
    Ahh… Lightbulb! That Lipps held off signing these particular 3 subpoenas is what triggered the process? Add defense attorney saying it hinders his defense strategy… If a standard due process of such subpeonas or not?
    Certainly would add an air of suspicion on why done!
    Their testimony hurting prosecution case against Ma’lik. Yes it would ultimately defy JD justice if he got acquitted bc of testimony. However if the wrong guy was on trial, or more a framed right place but wrong time circumstance. Or only one, more trivial (use analytical thinking of details on true assault in its full capacity required here) piece in the puzzle of crime reality.
    It should give some pause for concern as to cover-up possibilities. And if they are released from subpoena obligations & restrictions (assuming they were willing witnesses) I’d be pleading for them to tell their stories to the press ASAP!

    Reply
  4. C Morgan

    Oh BS! One of the witnesses was the 14 year old rape victim (allegedly)?
    I only support this if… Charges are pending in her case, to be filed after. From a legal perspective, if her testimony could be later used against her in some capacity… I can see the need to protect her credibility.
    But only only only, that criminal case will be filed and prosecuted!

    Reply
  5. UncleRay

    Ok Prinnie ley me give you the extreme example. If a person has the right to face their accuser , how would you ever get a conviction in a murder case? The accuser is the State of Ohio, the complaintant is the parents of a juvenille, the juvenille is a witness.

    Hopefully the AG thinking that they don’t need JD’s testimony means that they have enough other evidence for the conviction.

    They need a conviction in this case before they can charge any by-standers with failure to report a crime. That is why no others have been charged.(IMHO)

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      The accuser in a murder case can’t show up for obvious reasons, and I agree the state becomes the accuser. I totally agree with they need a conviction before they can file charges – because currently it is just an “allegation” in legal terms. Any thoughts on the WV Judge’s ruling – do you think someone filed a motion to quash the subpoenas? If not, is it a matter of routine for Judge’s to rule on simple subpoenas to compel witnesses to court?

      Reply
  6. C Morgan

    To clarify… The 3 witnesses are the 14 year old Apr alleged victim. And the 2 longtime friends (or former) of JD. Correct?
    It was said elsewhere by same (fruity) mom, that these girls claim to have picked her up in the morning, or called one of their dads to. That they took her to the party, cautioned her not to leave with, but she ignored. That she had less than pure intentions going, etc etc… In what we know thus far on evidence as testimony (< lot of bs), online accounts of night. If truly just intent to victim blame & smear reputation? Good riddance! Although if they are credible and have REAL testimonial evidence (not hearsay) to offer, then it would seem an injustice to not be heard.
    Apr victim for defense is odd angle. I get her case alone, the need for protecting identity & credibility IF her case is pending. But if it were to indicate who raped her, and at least one is not named a part to, is that relevant or not? Perhaps to discredit other testimony or character of? But that might be overruled as not supported legally thus far.
    Idk just a weird development in general.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      14 year old does not live in WV. I read that the three were Jane Doe and her two friends that she went to the first party with. I’ll have to find the link again.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        Derp! See below!!

        Reply
    2. C Morgan

      To also clarify, the story of friends was said a couple months ago on a sports blog.

      Reply
  7. UncleRay

    http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2013/03/west_va_judge_denies_request_f.html

    Attorney Walter Madison considered two of the witnesses, longtime friends of the victim, to be key to his 16-year-old client’s defense.

    The other subpoena was for the 16-year-old Weirton, West Va. girl whose parents first reported she was raped in mid-August after she attended a high school party where area students were drinking.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Thank you for posting that. I knew I read it but couldn’t remember where. I read so much online and try to stay on top of what is out there. Thanks again. 🙂

      Reply
  8. C Morgan

    If it were issued for JD (and not Apr JD) who will testify. Both defense attornies will have opportunity to cross examine, thus a subpoena of her seems a moot point. I’m very confused as swore I read the identities of 3 were the 14 yr old alleged victim, and 2 lifelong ( now former), friends of JD. Typo of age?

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Ok retract the above lol! But not the part re cross examining! /:

      Reply
  9. C Morgan
    1. C Morgan

      http://touch.latimes.com/#section/-1/article/p2p-74744953/
      Another good one that touches on the epic fail of the parent education class, 18 only attended. I’m not sure I agree with their victim depiction? but Prinnie is credited in.

      Reply
      1. zooeyinexile

        It’s a sad state of affairs in the city, most just in the mindset now “if we pretend there is no problem, there is no problem.” Life seems to be back to the usual empty headed life, so many are accustom to here and everywhere, for that matter. This is now an “old story” despite the fact the trial hasn’t yet happened. Newspapers here full of sports and other mindless waste. Isn’t that the way of our whole world in this country. Not just here. Few are interested in that which is really important. The low info folks, which has to be 75% of this country, remain concerned only with themselves, their amusements, keeping their stupid little comfort zones status quo. We sadly now live in a world of the self absorbed, regardless of socio- economic status. This saga will soon be over for this once proud steel town, now lost in time. Most of the residents just want to go back to their fantasy world here, where HS sports is what makes the place great, as they wander blindly amidst the rusty shambles of the skeleton of a once great city founded in Courage and Goodness. My heart is broken seeing what has become of us.

        Reply
        1. C Morgan

          That is a truly unfortunate and sad outcome of. An absolute shame that it could not be used in a positive manner, as a baseline for improvements where needed. But to do so, would require admittance of errors in judgement, actions, and attitudes by those especially in positions of authority. Yet their chosen denial only adds to the existing problems.
          I only hope for those that share your dissatisfaction with the status-quo… the additional publicity, and (hopefully) any later federal intervention stemming from the trial, serves only to further expose and force that change in motion.
          Don’t surrender all faith. Everything happens for a reason, and this case exploding serves a higher purpose, likely not yet revealed. That I truly believe.

          Reply
  10. Vicki T

    One legal maneuver is to subpena somebody who could cause damaging testimony to your client. The defense subpenas an individual making them a defense witness so the prosecution can’t use them as a witness. The defense then does not call the person to testify thus muting their testimony.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Interesting point there.
      Does it still apply if subpoena was denied?

      Reply
    2. BaronvSteuben

      Not true. Any witness can be issued a subpoena by the plaintiff and defendant in any case.

      Reply
  11. FYI
    1. John Lewis

      The only thing Trent Mays’ parents were remotely concerned about was their little baby being arrested “with all those lights”. Not a thought for JD.

      At least they were able to take him to California.

      Decent report by ESPN.

      Reply
      1. John Lewis

        P.s. if body language means anything check out the number of times DeWine blinks when asked about cutting a deal!

        Reply
      2. haradanohime

        It wasn’t Trent that went to California it was Malik with his former legal guardians. And that decision has always had me questioning Judge Lipps impartiality.

        Reply
        1. C Morgan

          Glad I’m not the only one. I just can’t shake that nagging gut feeling, of what idk!
          Although I don’t think it’s a case of his willingness to assist in the cover-up & downplay of the crime. Or even if a case of fall guys/scapegoat potential.
          Perhaps someone has dug into prior case rulings? (If not all sealed as juvenile cases?) As retired, less repercussions from ruling exist. I do think he has shown too much leniency at times. Do approve of most rulings on pre-trial motions though. I-just-dk!

          Reply
  12. C Morgan

    Given the less than stellar local LE history of. Knowing the all too common tactic of most, using little fish sink big fish… Rather curious why the struggle for witnesses then, or willing to testify cooperatively now, is even an issue?? Cooperate or we charge you with underage drinking, accessory to crime, failure to report a felony crime in progress, accomplice to rape, obstruction of justice, tampering with evidence… Not like they don’t have a multitude of charges to pull from! Just saying.
    Also Howarth’s parents for one, should be charged with alcohol provided. There’s a flipping case of beer clearly visible in Nodi video! Out in the open of room filmed. Mom was home and came into room to kick people out, no? Add the excuse for Nodi they made on his behalf, drunk & stupid! I know states require even less for charging parents for. Including even when out of town.

    Reply
  13. C Morgan

    Gotcha @Baronvsteuben.

    In regards to the hoodlum witnesses subpoenaed, and their in-school huddles making plans to “avoid” testifying cooperatively… Best heed this warning:
    Refusing to Testify (based upon federal interpretation of US Constitution)

    [If a juvenile refuses to appear or to testify, this can result in contempt of court. The judge can then order the juvenile to be held in jail until such time that the juvenile agrees to testify. The judge does not need the child’s parent’s approval to do so. The only time this does not occur is if the juvenile is the accused party in a criminal trial. Under the Fifth Amendment of the U.S. Constitution the accused party does not need to testify against himself.]

    And regarding the WV teens absolved from subpoenas… Appears to be the trump card played…

    [The power to call a juvenile witness is the same as that for an adult. The legal party must use a subpoena to compel the witness to testify either in a deposition or in court. Once served, the juvenile witness can’t refuse unless he can convince the court it would be a bad idea. To do so the witness needs to appear and make a motion for an exception. The witness, juvenile or adult, does however retain the right to be represented by counsel in court proceedings aside from direct testimony.]

    http://www.ehow.com/info_8593964_laws-juvenile-testifying-court-law.html

    Reply
  14. BaronvSteuben

    C Morgan, in regards to the WV Circuit Court judgment quashing the subpoenas; Madsion’s only recourse would be to appeal to the WV Supreme Court. There are no intermediate courts of appeal in WV. Doesn’t look likely since the trial starts Wednesday. The WV Supreme Court would have to an expedited appeal heard and agree with his legal position. Seems unlikely.

    Reply
  15. BaronvSteuben

    As far as witnesses taking the 5th; it would make sense since they would be in potential jeopardy of future criminal prosecution (Failure to report a Crime, Underage Consumption, Furnishing Alcohol to an Underage Person, etc.).

    Judge Lipps has the authority to grant these witnesses immunity; meaning they could be compelled to testify. A refusal could be considered contempt of court. Their testimony could not be used in any future criminal proceedings against them. It will be interesting to see if either the prosecution or defense makes a request for Judge Lipps to immunize any witnesses.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Very good points. I think Madison’s statements on the ruling, match your assessment of defeat of securing these witnesses. Would this give any potential for a later appeal? If they testimony were in fact, crucial to the defense strategy. Thus a guilty verdict results without.
      I believe the kids plotting to use the 5th, were of the thinking it could be applied as a catch all, a refusal to answer any questioning and/or avoid testifying. But Appears also, Lipps intends to enforce cooperation from. So without pending charges, wouldn’t the line of questioning, based upon where the 5th is given in answer, indicate some implied self incrimination?
      Overall, a tricky situation. As there was multi potential crimes committed alongside of the assault, or a part to, as you noted. Should prove interesting… If they opt to be recorded.

      Reply
    2. prinnie (Post author)

      Thanks for the information.

      I am going to be off the blog for the better part of the next 2 days. I might check in, but will be traveling. Stay out of trouble everyone. 🙂

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        Happy trails (: Look forward to ur return. I’ll keep 1 eye on the bridge too…

        Reply
      2. PrinniesDoe

        Be safe Prinnie; and you are doing an awesome job for all the Jane Does!

        Reply
  16. C Morgan

    Nice job on ESPN. Glad to see some solid coverage.
    @john Lewis yes I did. I noted the hesitation a couple questions, where you could see the wheels spinning… How can I word or spin this carefully?! And the flat out denial of immunity, without acknowledging his assistant AG’s letters, falsely suggesting just that?
    And on the Mays: Yep, “not my son,” immediate & continued denial, it would seem. JD the enemy, as omitting of mention, speaks louder than words.
    @FYI thx for posting the link. Here it is again, in case anyone missed above.
    http://espn.go.com/espn/otl/index

    Reply
  17. BaronvSteuben

    In response to your questions C Morgan:

    1. The quashing of the subpoenas would not be grounds for appeal by Madison in the event of a Richmond conviction. The judgment was from Circuit Court Judge Wilson and not Judge Lipps. No Lipps ruling; no alleged error to appeal from.

    Indirectly could this be an appellate issue? Possibly. If Madison argued that he needed a continuance to litigate the subpoena issue in the state of WV and Judge Lipps denied that request; then Madison could argue on appeal that Lipps abused his discretion in denying a reasonable continuance to secure the testimony of material witnesses to the defense. A longshot at best. In Madison’s comment to the Wilson decision, there was nothing that indicated he would appeal the ruling.

    2. As far as witnesses taking the 5th; they would not be answering any questions pertaining to the night in question. You don’t get to pick and choose which questions you will answer or not answer once under oath. More than likely they would answer the name and address questions, then take the 5th once specific questioning about August began. F Lee Bailey tried to use that tactic in a US District Court during the Patty Hearst bank robbery trial; he put her up to answer some questions, and tried to argue she could take 5 on certain questions posed by the US District attorney. Federal judge hearing the case didn’t buy the argument; Hearst had to answer questions on cross-examination by the prosecutor and was ultimately convicted.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Thank you kindly for clarifying the 5th as applied. I guess Lipps will have to play hardball as he gave his intent to in Jan, regarding this issue. Although it arose from the old immunity debate. That the court held powers of contempt to utilize in getting cooperation.
      The fact remains, without victim having any memory of, witness accounts are crucial to this case. Considering the supposed lack of physical evidence. The circumstantial (?) evidence, rumored to not have been obtained. Like crucial cell provider records… Containing Text’s, media transmissions, ping data of whereabouts. Thus if most all plead 5th to the night as a whole, how can the case progress in prosecution adequately?
      But then, perhaps there in lies the overall agenda all along? and the trial will ultimately reveal it. That ties back to the beginning, when digital media vanished, certain procedures to secure physical evidence were allegedly not taken, etc… Etc… & etc…

      Thank you on explanation of the potential of appeal, the grounds needed that don’t exist. I agree it does not seem he intends to fight it.
      I missed reading the basis of the case coming before WV courts?
      So Was it that Lipps signed off on the subpoenas, And the recipients filed the motion in WV to be released of obligation to? Or was it a legal court procedure needed in cases of state line barriers, or juvenile non-resident subpoenas?
      15 mins travel seems as much a stretch as the claim, CK was out of town the night in question! However the rumored intent by (Former) lifelong friends of (WV subpoenas), was said to be of defamation variety and victim blaming. Thus maybe best left unsaid, per OH rape shield laws. IMO

      Your legal insight is oh so very helpful, and willing recipient of. (: Sorry to pick your brain!

      Reply
  18. BaronvSteuben

    C Morgan; AG DeWine is correct when he stated that Cole, Craig and Westlake haven’t been granted immunity. Immunity is granted by a court. How it is granted is addressed in the Ohio Revised Code. As of today; Judge Lipps has not granted any witness immunity.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Yes, a judge can only grant immunity for testimony as I understand it. My point was, he did not address the letters issued by his office representatives. That attorney/s were claiming in press earlier, granted these clients/witnesses immunity from prosecution. Thus the publics arising confusion from, and ongoing debate.
      Further he said at an initial juncture, they did have immunity.
      Then, they did not in any capacity.
      Next it was, Yes they do, but only on this one crime noted. They can still be prosecuted for subsequent crimes that arise from.
      Now he’s back to nope. And without any addressing of the infamous letters causing confusion! Lol
      And I still have to wonder, if the author of 2 of 3 letters of intent, is no longer with AG for these having just a tiny part in why (on either side). Given AAG’s can be newbies in the field, one could see where this error in judgement, overstepping of legal boundaries, or misstep in procedures to secure evidence in a case… Might have occurred. But just my opinion.

      Reply
  19. Hatetosayit

    A couple of things:

    1) AG/DA would be the one to bring Cole, Westlake or anyone else up on charges so Dewine’s statements are true. They only provided written agreements saying the wouldn’t charge those 3 who testified at the prob cause hearing due to lack of evidence. I believe they stated in court and this appears in the transcripts, that they are lucky the videos/ photos were not recovered or things would have been much different for them. I also read those letters and I’m thinking they aren’t out of the woods yet anyway. Should new evidence, testimony or eye witnesses come out during the trial they could potentially turn around and charge them. That was my take away from the letters anyway.

    2) I was one who felt a lot more people should have been brought up on charges initially however now I’m wondering if this is all part of the prosecutors strategy. Once the trial is over he has more room. If the boys are convicted then its a lot easier to bring people up on failing to report a crime, tampering with evidence/witnesses etc. Should the boys be acquitted then those charges would have been dropped anyway since there would no longer be a “crime” to report.

    3) Question, who are people on here thinking could potentially be planning to plead the 5th on the stand? Not the 3 from the prob cause hearing right? Can they even do that? I was under the impression the were willing to testify and not forced to. Why would they invoke that right now. Aren’t they the whole case according to the prosecution?

    4) Do we know who is on the whiteness list? I hope Nodi is! Clearly he was provided information/evidence from those involved. It’s considered hersay unless he or the person who sent the details to him testify to it. Isn’t this normally public record since both sides have to supply it to one another?

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Just my 2 cents here, & hope a little helpful (:
      1. Yes they did say that in transcript. I have wondered if the pics/videos did surface (given Instagram has a main database of original pics. And YouTube too I think)… Would they not have to eat those words? And per AG latest stand re. noted. On legal technicality, there is no true binding immunity from the letters. I Suppose it’s more of a written promise of intent, to get their cooperation of testimony. But in reality, it holds no weight if AG Ofc or PA/DA chose to prosecute later.
      2. I agree on the theory for delay to charge others, based upon trial evidence and testimony. But with a twist. A less honorable ulterior motive behind it. So more of a wait-see on what does surface and is admissible. And from this, who and for what crime, are they ultimately on the line to seek prosecution of.
      Meaning… we don’t want to shine negative light on any “special” people unnecessarily!
      And if the DOJ/ACLU were going to take any action, it would wait until post trial. On record accounts of any civil violations, injustice, or official’s wrongdoing, seems only logical to me.
      3. I believe the 3 would be expected to further testify in trial. I noted defense attorney laying some groundwork to build upon. I suppose it could be comparable to witnesses for grand jury hearings. I would think 5th would not apply to them, since it has to be used in context of the entire night in question, and any details of. (as baronvsteuben explained it best) Seems they cancelled that out. I also think they can reference their responses in transcript, upon further questioning.
      4. I have heard a, could be interesting, name or 2 in passing, but not on official record… so I guess I can’t say. (Subpoenas as public info? IDK) As a juvenile proceeding, or those of being minors, I assume different rules apply from adult criminal/civil proceedings. But as predicted, there was some local buzz amongst them, and in regards to.

      I’m sure this could all be added upon.

      Reply
  20. C Morgan

    http://www.mommyish.com/2013/03/10/steubenville-gang-rape-trial/2/

    Nice job sorting out the bs in Columbus article referenced within. As well as reminders of the inside circus created by the ‘truth oppressors,’ in attempts to shield the real story taking center stage.

    Reply
  21. Alchemist

    @BaronvSteuben March 11, 2013 at 1:49 am

    As far as witnesses taking the 5th; it would make sense since they would be in potential jeopardy of future criminal prosecution (Failure to report a Crime, Underage Consumption, Furnishing Alcohol to an Underage Person, etc.).

    Judge Lipps has the authority to grant these witnesses immunity; meaning they could be compelled to testify. A refusal could be considered contempt of court. Their testimony could not be used in any future criminal proceedings against them. It will be interesting to see if either the prosecution or defense makes a request for Judge Lipps to immunize any witnesses.

    If I am not mistaken, grants of immunity are conditional, not absolute. In order to be granted immunity, the witness must cooperate fully, and tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. If they later can be shown to have failed to do so, the grant of immunity can be withdrawn, rendering them once more liable to prosecution.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Well crap! Bc if PC hearing testimony is any indication of what’s to come… The Whole truth seems to be in the perception of the witness only. I did not miss several contradictory details given by the 3 boys. Interesting the 2 i believe with counsel, had more parallel, and far less incriminating versions.

      Reply
    2. BaronvSteuben

      You are spot on Alchemst; full cooperation is necessary for immunity.

      Reply
  22. BooBoo

    Looks like there is a second video which depicts the victim naked with semen on her chest….

    Breaking: New information in Steubenville Case
    Submitted by Don Carpenter on Mon, 03/11/2013 – 11:33 #occupysteubenville #oprollredroll Big Red Football Team breaking news Independent Journalism LIVE PHOTO / TEXT Steubenville rape case

    Late last night, sources have confirmed to me that a second Steubenville Video besides Nodianos’ existed at one point on youtube and may infact exist offline. Prosecutors have been unable to retrieve deleted photos, videos, and text messages from over 15 confiscated phones during the Steubenville Police Department investigation which led to charging Trent Mays and Ma’lik Richmond with the alleged rape of 16 year old Jane Doe in August of 2012.

    This second video allegedly depicts Jane Doe passed out Naked with Semen on her chest, as people wonder aloud if she is breathing, kick her to see if she will wake up and urinate on her.

    Investigators and Prosecutors have been unable to find this video, but simple research and warrants to youtube would reveal that this video was posted to youtube on or around August 12, 2013, and removed days later.

    Read the rest here: http://mobilebroadcastnews.com/NewsRoom/Don-Carpenter/Breaking-New-information-Steubenville-Case

    Reply
    1. Hatetosayit

      This information seems suspicious considering the trial is just 2 day away. Why are we just now hearing details of a second video? Not sure I’m buying what the author
      is selling.

      Reply
      1. BooBoo

        This isn’t knew info. Many people were told about this second video prior to today. Don confirmed it last night through his sources that there is in fact a second video. Go look at his twitter he posted screen shots of what looks like some sort of official looking records with names redacted https://twitter.com/NUNYAMAN As I said many have heard about this video it was just never confirmed till last night. I believe Don, he would never make up a story for any reason especially not one about a young girl being raped,

        Reply
        1. Hatetosayit

          I’m off to look! Thanks for the additional details!

          Reply
        2. Hatetosayit

          Still not sure what I’m looking at. Are these notes taken during conversations he had with sources?

          Reply
          1. BooBoo

            Looks like hospital records. You can see at the bottom on one where is says examined by

  23. C Morgan

    Booboo, Thanks for alerting us to this development.
    I doubt I’m alone in feeling From my day 1, of this case via UK MailOnline in Dec… My immediate gut was there is so much more than surface value! Some were clearly being shielded. And the two charged, likely a part to, Were potential fall guys.
    I read what I could find, and that led me here. Filtering through rumors, articles, twitter land, in-depth social media searches. Hearing both sides… My gut never changed, but only intensified, rationalized and analyzed with logic. Only cemented by evidence supporting the profiling expected of such Degenerates. Curiously they weren’t the ones charged most often.
    Names never even mentioned surfaced, that had firsthand knowledge, and even admission like comments & dialogue, long after aug! (Passed on). Past crew ref’s by alumni!
    Trust me when I say, some of these cretans are only proud of their criminal Acts. Even More brazen bc they go unscathed by, living above the law! It proved a disturbing window into a portion of society (not community as a whole), sociopathic & narcissistic personalities are of the norm. And other illegal activities by, are only encouraged, nurtured, and protected by certain adults. The athletes on pedestals aspect of, contributing to the dynamic does exist. If even just a means of selection, of those chosen to groom irresponsibly with special privileges.
    What’s most sick here, is the adults responsible, still fail to see the problem! Or choose denial? And when this case brought it to international attention, it only served to trigger suppressing the truth and protecting those suspect. And render defensive attacks by means of deflective, unsubstantiated allegations. The miscalculation of the forthcoming and unrelenting exposure, is now their crux. We can only hope they have to answer for.
    Hypothetically… Get rid of evidence, intimidate the victim from pursuing, witnesses already complying with expected & dutiful silence … And It all goes away! A likely more common procedure than not, as history seems to imply.
    Hence the dire importance of Prinnie, Anonymous, media, and supporters of the truth. The demand for The real story, justice for JD, LE to hold all those a part to accountable, and the opportunity for change by the portion of a community that fostered such an atrocity.
    Only hoping the trial will help to start the process of redemption.

    Reply
  24. Hatetosayit

    You have to be kidding me! Defense attorney requested this case to be dismissed!!

    http://www.10tv.com/content/stories/2013/03/11/steubenville-attorneys-seek-dismissal-of-case.html

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      Not going to happen, Would be an issue on appeal.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        So is this his angle to secure the later cause for appeal (if guilty verdict), we discussed earlier? And this would be sufficient basis for, or not?
        I’ve always half expected the charges to disappear by some means, or found not guilty for lack of evidence. In just going with the underlying theme of this entire case: appease the masses… they go away… and we dissolve the fall guys of any further responsibility for. (As promised??)
        And in keeping with suspicious me—
        Just a theory of question? Could the WV witnesses have been “encouraged” to pursue legal release of subpoenas, to more so benefit the defense’s real strategy? Thus producing a grounds for them to file a motion for dismissal? And in doing so, perhaps secures a plan B, cause for appeal?? Idk but Hmm.

        Reply
        1. BaronvSteuben

          I doubt that C Morgan. Remember, the best chance for legal success for Mays and Richmond is at the trial court level. The State cannot appeal an acquittal. If these witnesses create reasonable doubt; then the time to call them is now.

          Appellate courts deal with error. No new trial. If Mays and/or Richmond are acquitted, they will most likely be incarcerated in a DYS (juvenile prison) facility. On appeal, the defense would have to argue there was error(s) made at the trail court level, AND the error is so serious it merits a reversal of judgement. Tough to accomplish under any circumstances.

          Reply
          1. BaronvSteuben

            Should read ‘convicted’ not ‘acquitted’ in 2nd paragraph. My bad.

          2. C Morgan

            Sorry I likely worded my theory/question incorrectly /: I meant only from the defense side for appeal.
            But I’m glad to hear that this new dismissal attempt, won’t create the possibility for appeal. And not very realistic for the ruling to dismiss charges.
            Thus If acquitted, the state blew it. And double jeopardy protects the defendants from being tried again.
            And yet, I’m simply not very optimistic of the prosecution’s case. Biggest reason, if they had obtained sufficient evidence, it would indicate a thorough investigation was conducted. And that investigation & resulting evidence from, would have implicated further suspects needing charged with assault. But that never transpired.

      2. prinnie (Post author)

        I still believe that everyone – including these boys should have the same constitutional rights to due process as you or I. Not sure what happened at the press conference as I am out of town — but can someone fill me in. Thanks!! Who all was present and what was discussed? I thought that the chief of police and city manager were to speak — not sure what the City Manager has to offer at this point. Thanks again!!!

        Reply
        1. maddgramma

          I watched News 9 and as far as The City Mgr. and Police Chief along with Mrs. Hersery from Chambe of Commerce, and a Business Owner? It’ s going to be business as usual! Nothing to brag about! Police Chief doesn’t think there will be an problems! Be Safe in your travels Friend!!

          Reply
        2. maddgramma

          Prinnie. Judge Wilson from WV has to go back over his reading per WV State Supreme Court. He is going behind closed doors at 8:00 tonite. I don’t think he will change his mind on his first ruling as far as the 3 Juveniles from WV not appearing in Court. I guess we have to wait and see.

          Reply
        3. BooBoo

          It was a pep rally for the media. City Manager started it off by saying that the conference was about Steubenville and not the case. That should tell you what it was about LOL. Chief blamed social media for the way the world looks at Steubenville, Some woman got up talking about how the city supports the sports teams and schools and spoke of how many churches the city has and how much the people of Steubenvile donate to The United Way. What that has to do with anything is beyond me. Jerry Barrila “known as Mr Steubenville” said he was angry how the media keeps showing video of boarded up buildings and less attractive store fronts. Apparently he doesn’t like the poorer part of town seen. I’m sorry but I think it was stupid. Never in my life have I seen a city do such ridiculous news conferences trying to convince the world how wonderful they are.

          Reply
  25. Alchemist

    What has surprised me is that it was Trent May’s attorney who moved for dismissal, and not Ma’Lik’s. Trent has more than the rape charge to contend with, he also has the child pornography charge stemming from the images found on his phone. The witness non-appearance does not affect that.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Good catch. I bet this has more to do with Trent, bc he was the link to reel her in on the conspired plan. (Still stand behind conspiracy orchestrated by CS) And it was said there was ongoing prior texting between he and JD, leading up to. So it would make sense her GF’s would claim to have inside knowledge of that “relationship.” And given alleged to be former friends, likely defaming details of her reputation or intentions with. But that would seem a lot of hearsay, unless they had more proof of.
      So it does seem confusing considering Malik’s attorney’s very vocal comments regarding to the press.

      Reply
  26. Hatetosayit

    I’m very nervous that the 2pm press conference is regarding the case being dismissed! Anyone else think this could be the case?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben
      1. WeirSteuben

        WTOV9’s story told me absolutely nothing!! What did they say at the press conference??

        Reply
        1. prinnie (Post author)

          What happened at the news conference?

          Reply
          1. BooBoo

            I thought I commented to this post but I guess I commented it to your post above LOL

          2. C Morgan

            @Booboo…
            Wow, that was an embarrassing waste of an opportunity. A misguided “Pep rally,” does seem to suit it well. Did they make a symbolic huddle, before tackling the mic too? :b

            But in their defense of offensive tactics… Consistency of deflection is The game! And keeping in-line with their “25 ways to suppress the truth” play-book, they had to make one last ditch effort on their goal… By calling “foul!” on everyone, but the Rape Crew & officials!
            Do recall, a lot of money (booster club support?) funded the DC Public Relations crew. Hired by the city, to come in and coach their team, new to exposure & scrutiny.
            Imagine how that money could have served a far better Cause? Such as a Reward offer?! For any information leading to additional arrests! Given their insistence, witnessess & evidence was lacking. Or Perhaps more likely benched?

            Thus we the people/referees, should then call it??
            (International whistle blowing begin!)
            Call for forfeit! For failing to take that chance, to finally show support for Jane Doe. And address trial concerns second. That seems more on target for a “press conference.”?!

            Ok punny time over. And for the record on technicality… I personally, I have never liked football!! Just saying.

  27. PrinniesDoe

    Did anyone see the little 2020 clip RadioNewz has up? They are interveiwing Malik. Wasn’t it stated somewhere that Malik didn’t have a cell phone? Well in this interview with 2020 he says people were texting him saying JD said she was raped.. Hmmm?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      Bad move to have Richmond speak on the record before trial. State will have a copy. If his story changes from the interview; they’ll hammer him.

      Reply
    2. prinnie (Post author)

      That’s interesting, as I was under the impression that he didn’t have a cell phone either. As I have said repeatedly, we won’t know it all until it plays out in court, but with that said — due process is required.

      Reply
      1. UncleRay

        When the investigators did the first round of phone confiscations Ma’liks phone wasn’t included
        When he was arrested a week later they had a warrant and confiscated several electronic devices. They were unsure if the phone that they believe he possessed on the night in question was included.

        Direct testimony in the probable cause hearing puts a cell phone in his right hand while he appears to be penetrating JD with his left hand.

        Reply
        1. prinnie (Post author)

          There is no face in that photo — unless they identified the cell pings for his phone (if he had one) how can they prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the photo is him? These are the things that should have been done from the beginning. Why was none of that type of information obtained?

          Reply
  28. ResoL411

    Liars…all of them. Someone will get to them and hold them accountable for this.

    Reply
  29. Hatetosayit

    What time does the trial start and will it be on tv?

    Reply
    1. maddgramma

      It starts at 10:30 tmorrow and 9;00 on Thurs. and Fri.

      Reply
      1. Hatetosayit

        Thanks do you know how an out of town’r can watch the trial?

        Reply
        1. maddgramma

          I don’t know. I wouldgo to WTOV9 webpage tomorrow and see what Natalie Herbick has to say or go to her Twitter Page.

          Reply
  30. Alchemist

    @BaronvSteuben March 12, 2013 at 3:17 pm

    Bad move to have Richmond speak on the record before trial. State will have a copy. If his story changes from the interview; they’ll hammer him.

    Under normal circumstances, I’d agree with you 100%. However, in light of the setback regarding the subpoenas of the witnesses from WV, I find myself wondering if his attorney isn’t up to something. (I can’t believe that Ma’Lik or his guardians would allow him to go on the record in an interview, without his attorney’s prior knowledge and consent. The Agrestas are no fools — you will remember that they did not entrust Ma’Lik’s welfare to one of the local shysters, but went outside the community for an counselor who would mount an aggressive defence.)

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      In regards to his chat. Perhaps it was agreed to bc of the delayed airing of. I wondered if they expected the early teasers? Or if perhaps he was compensated for? With the additional side show of motion filings, maybe added private investigator fees… The bill has likely only increased from.
      So my thought was Madison agreed to it, bc he likely wants to be paid in full?
      There isn’t a jury pool to risk tainting. Madison has been periodically vocal, leaking this spin or that one. Always themed in victim blaming!
      But as for public opinion, confirmed it for me, he deserves no sympathy nor leniency! Ma’lick, What a ball-lacking POS!
      I was disgusted by it (ABC written article). The lugging around like a dead body has already been validated, by more than one of his loser friends. Yet he claims she was merely playing along, finding funny.? That her arm around his shoulder and hand on his chest signaled to him a green light for later!?! Considering how incapacitated she became, she was likely doing to hold herself up jackass!
      And regardless if she was promising the world in a drunkin stupor, in spite of her established interest in Trent not Mays, Once she became visibly intoxicated, it was hands off! Unconscious? Unless he’s admitting to being a pervert with necrophilia issues? you only assist in seeking help for her, caring for & watching out for if needed. NOT take advantage & violate, assault & Rape, photograph, pass her around!
      I find it horrible that this assault is still being downplayed, a defense shaped around victim blaming?!
      The still underlying plague here is the denial. Or r is it that some are so immorally conditioned, they truly can’t grasp such a basic human concept… was wrong, is wrong, will still be wrong! no matter the outcome, no matter the excuses, or blaming, however spun!
      And the more the village idiots put their “town,” aka. “personal interests,” aka. “Big Red” aka. “Degenerates,” before some semblance of support for JD, justice fully, & truth… The more ignorant, insensitive, and corrupt they appear. There is an absolute disconnect here.

      I have to believe the part of community that gets it, far outnumbers the bad. Certain Power lie in numbers, and ultimately if they could utilize the press and public support in this brief moment, to address. Change might just be what they make it…

      And then I just read the briefest mention of witnesses being threatened? Pathetic!

      Reply
  31. Alchemist

    It now appears that there has been appeal from the West Virginia judge’s ruling, disallowing the subpoena of the West Virginia witnesses. An appeal was made to the WV Supreme Court, who remanded the file back to the original court. A ruling is due at 8:00 p.m., Tuesday, March 12, 2013. It remains to be seen whether the higher court will have overturned the lower court’s decision.

    Reply
  32. Alchemist

    Hancock County Hearing Held on Eve of Rape Trial
    Posted: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 6:12 PM EST Updated: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 6:12 PM EST
    Hancock County, W.Va. –

    West Virginia Circuit Judge Ronald Wilson will hold a hearing at 8 p.m. Tuesday in Hancock County concerning three teens testimony in the Steubenville Rape trial.

    This past Friday Judge Wilson rejected requests that the West Virginia juveniles be required to testify, but an attorney for one of the defendants took the issue to the West Virginia Supreme Court of Appeals.

    They referred to the state’s Uniform Act, which many states have to compel witnesses to cross state lines.

    West Virginia law requires the circuit court to set a hearing which is what will take place tonight.

    Judge Wilson will rule tonight whether the three will be compelled to testify in the delinquency hearing on the criminal complaint of rape .

    Reply
  33. PrinniesDoe

    WVa. Judge Wilson just ruled all 3 will testify at trail.

    Reply
    1. UncleRay

      This brings us to the most important reason that this trial needed to be open to the public.
      Is it so that we can hear the details of a gang rape then feign outrage? No
      Is it to back check the detective work? No
      Is it to insure that the rape shield laws are enforced? That JD isn’t eviscerated by the defense counsel? That the judge and AG hold a fair trial yet still protect the rights of a juvenile rape victim?

      Anyone who followed the Orange County JD case from 10 years ago knows what hell a victim can go thru at the hands of an out of control defense.

      I only have hope that this case will be different.

      Excerpt from OC JD;

      The worst form of degradation there is,” Jane Doe told me in a recent e-mail, “is being sexually assaulted while unconscious by the people you call your friends.”
      Her note came after several weeks of phone calls and e-mails to her lawyer, Sheldon Lodmer. Jane Doe agreed to respond only through her attorney and only to written questions.
      Still, she had something powerful to say, adding more about “degradation.”
      “(Try) having your entire life and medical history put out in the open for the public to see and slander your name more. Then top it off with 24 jurors between two different trials, lawyers, judges, law enforcement and many others watching a videotape of your lifeless, naked body being sexual assaulted and abused.
      “Now that is true degradation.”

      Reply
  34. Congo

    You know what this all revolves around. Not so much a rape, but a city getting tired of the local corruption. Seems the mainstream nation media is missing that aspect. They have no idea how corrupt the legal system is, in this area.

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      That is a major point. And, I think you are correct that many in the media are missing the corruption angle. Don’t they read this excellent and well researched blog first? it would help their coverage!

      Reply
  35. ack

    We have all noticed that, How is it they do such a lousy journalstic job that they have not looked into this whole side of the story. Yes it is a horrendous gang rape case, but do they do no investigative work? They missed the whole local cupption piiece of the pie. How hard could that be? Look at some of the blogs that have plenty more truth than does local media. msm lost their credibility many years ago, lazy and compromised, just like the local outlets. Pathetic

    Reply
  36. Alchemist

    Posted: 10:07 p.m. Tuesday, March 12, 2013
    BREAKING: West Virginia Judge issues ruling; Teens will be forced to testify
    By NEWS9

    HANCOCK COUNTY, W.Va—

    West Virginia Judge Ronald Wilson has issued a ruling following a hearing on whether three West Virginia teens can be compelled to testify in the Steubenville teen rape trial.

    The judge has ruled that two teen witnesses will be compelled to testify, the third witness, who is the accuser, has volunteered to testify in the trial.

    Tonight’s ruling reverses a previous ruling.

    Defense attorneys had previously told NEWS9 that the testimony of the teens in question would help their case.

    The trial is set to start tomorrow morning in Jefferson County.

    Stick with NEWS9, WTOV9.com and NEW9 Mobile for continuing coverage.

    Reply
  37. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

    Thank you, Alchemist! I am surprised at the late change.

    Reply
  38. C Morgan

    Amen! It defies logic of modern investigative techniques, in utilizing technology for evidence!
    But I doubt they ever thought this would make it to an actual trial! These type and other cases, involving the chosen ones, rarely if ever did! Nor would anyone dare question who, what, or why it fell to the wayside.
    As for Ma’lik. I believe it was his “Trac-phone”, or said to be, that was confiscated a week after the warrant was issued.
    Note: I trust they secured documentation to match serial numbers of phones and SIMM cards, to actual users and dates?? Oh, probably not.
    Note 2: was it not circulating back in that time period… Hanlin attempted to change ph numbers & get new phones? Hope the sales guy, or carrier documentation of, or witness to will be surfacing? Yeah, probably not.
    Few points to ponder here on that hand…
    – recall the attorney laid some preliminary reasonable doubt in PC hearing of who’s hand. But will he build on that?
    if you watch the Nodi video closely. The McDonald’s cup he routinely drinks from. coincides with holis obvious revent arrival from somewhere? 1 of boys testified that he and at least 1 other went to McD’s in route to or from i believe visit to Cole’s house. But not Nodi too??
    So did they obtain security video footage, or transaction of sale records for at least a time stamp for timeline. Who all was in car?
    Was it a 24 hr drive thru? 2 of 3 closest are… BUT I don’t think they were eating breakfast…
    And the switch starts at 5am… And the 2 menus don’t coincide.
    So, the video was said to be taken around 6am??? So how does that work out?
    Clearly they appear to have recently arrived, McDs onboard. Lets say post Coles, and in route back to Howarth’s. (west lake, Craig, Nodi, & ?? Idk). Their actions & body language supports this. His drink from is not old.
    Especially when a certain guy in red shirt & white hat & black (ID is out there). Toward end of debate, is one of intending to go see this firsthand. Moves from seat in front of TV, to left back of nodi, standing keys jingling in hand. If you listen just prior, the words are spoken “train, trains coming!” From where he was off camera, in very likely matching voice. He was not one who seemed to “defend” or have a prior vocal interest in the earlier rape debate. He only becomes animated on plans to attend Coles! His intentions clearly were not to rescue or intervene.
    Wonder if that hand places him there at the scene of final destination of rapeS???
    Just IMO.
    So many holes in timeline… Somebody worked hard to close windows of… Time for what, where, and who?!
    Z:{

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Was in ref to Prinnie/UncleRay Re. the hand…

      Reply
    2. prinnie (Post author)

      Yes, so many holes and if it is true that nothing was subpoenaed – that is a true miscarriage of justice. Getting phone records and pings would PROVE who was where and when. I hope that it is not true that these items were not obtained.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        And there in lies the reality… Like past misdeeds & history reveals, it was never meant to make it this far. (As you know best (: )
        And what has sadly, is only a portion of the story.

        Reply
  39. ChauvinismRequired

    Alexandria Goddard is a useless blogger trying to stir crap up. That’s what bloggers do. Like those who can’t make the police force become mall security guards, those who can’t become real reporters blog. she’s a one trick pony, a useless feminist who doesn’t realize any truths unless they help make her point. This is what happens to a woman who is sorely missing oral…

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      *yawn*

      Reply
    2. maddgramma

      You have no reason at all to defame Alex! At least she had the knowledge from day one to look into this crime. She does many other Honorable things too so, please don’t waste your time belittleling her. YAWN! YAWN!

      Reply
      1. prinnie (Post author)

        I am allowing the comments because I want people to see the behavior of some of these folks. They are showing their true colors.

        Reply
  40. C Morgan

    DYAC!
    *** if you watch the Nodi video closely. The McDonald’s cup he routinely drinks from, coincides with his obvious & recent arrival from somewhere? 1 of the boys testified, that he and at least 1 other person went to McD’s. Either in route to, or from a visit to Cole’s house.
    But not Nodi too?? ***

    Reply
  41. Alchemist

    Steubenville rape trial live streaming URL

    http://www.wtov9.com/videos/news/wtov-live-video/vD4xz/

    Reply
  42. Rose7

    Thank you for the link, Alchemist!! I’m on the live-feed!

    Reply
  43. Alchemist

    Live steams to Steuebenville, Ohio rape trial
    March 13, 2013 | by Radio | Blog

    http://www.wtov9.com/videos/news/wtov-live-video/vD4xz/ (original stream I posted)

    Here are two additional streams:

    http://www.newsnet5.com/subindex/news/news_livestream1

    http://www.wtrf.com/story/21627838/live-stream-steubenville-rape-trial-wednesday-march-13

    Additional streams courtesy of RadioNewz

    Reply
  44. irishgirl999

    I’ve been trying to catch the latest information on the trial.
    http://austinisafecker.wordpress.com/2013/03/13/steubenville-rape-case/

    Hope this is of some help.

    Reply
  45. Elliot N

    You too Prinnie! Hopefully justice will prevail in trial

    Reply
  46. KMac

    I admire all your work here and you have made such a tremendous difference. I’ve been following the case since December, and I just came across something that seemed new to me. On the Daily Mail (and elsewhere), the boy who filmed JD being violated in the car (and who later deleted it) was asked why he filmed the episode. The witness/videographer states, “I thought she might want to know what had gone on.” I’ve posted the reporting below. I realize that the video is gone, but here is a defense witness saying that the victim is too far gone to know what happened. If she were cognizant enough for consent, she would remember what happened. But that wasn’t the situation. The witness/videographer thought he needed to film the ‘episode’ so that the victim would remember — otherwise she would not know what happened. I’m not sure there could be a better witness for the prosecution.

    Forgive me if this has come up somewhere before. I just never heard anyone comment on it.

    ——Daily Mail——-
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2293005/Ohio-rape-case-Teenage-girl-raped-humiliated-Ohio-footballers-photographed-fours.html

    “There she was allegedly subjected to a series of humiliating sexual acts by one of the accused while the other digitally penetrated her, a repeat of behaviourthat allegedly took place in the back of a car on the way to the third party of the night when, of the five passengers, she was the solitary girl.

    A third youth – not facing charges – filmed her while one of the accused allegedly pulled up her top, exposing her breasts before violating her.

    When asked to explain his behavior the boy later claimed he thought the girl might want to know what had gone on. ”

    – Daily Mail.

    Reply
    1. tofu

      Excellent point, KMac. for anyone with a shred of common sense, these evidences and testimony already out should be enough to lock these scums up for life.
      ………………….
      the boy who filmed JD being violated in the car (and who later deleted it) was asked why he filmed the episode. The witness/videographer states, “I thought she might want to know what had gone on.” I’ve posted the reporting below. I realize that the video is gone, but here is a defense witness saying that the victim is too far gone to know what happened.

      Reply
  47. BaronvSteuben

    From the Steubenville Herald Star. Strong opening day for the prosecution IMO:
    http://hsconnect.com/page/content.detail/id/584224/Rape-Trial–Complete-Day-One-Coverage.html?nav=5010

    Reply
  48. fritz buzhardt

    Five questions:

    1. What the hell is taking so long? Justice delayed is justice denied, right?

    2. Why so many butt-inskis, when exactly none of them have the facts, pro or con?

    3. Why do the ‘protestors’ feel they have to hide behind masks?

    4. What evidence is there, precisely, to prove that a cover-up took/is taking place?

    And, finally, the question that probably should have been asked first:

    5. Where were the grown-ups?

    Reply
  49. toni b

    As to No3 If they happen to be from here, have ever faced any “officials” here in whatever capacity, you too would wear a mask. It is not safe. Do not know how to get this through to you not from here. if you ever went so far as to challange some of the “big shots” here, let us say via courts, turned them into the state officials, will leave it to you to figure out. you woud understand need to hide. It’s not safe. Though many have lost in smaller venues than this very important case, please understand, standing up to the ruling creeps here takes courage. And whether you win or lose, and most have lost, if stuck here we are still frightened of that power they hold over us.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Toni, and THAT is exactly why I have stated people wore masks. They are afraid. I was asked “what kind of retaliation” one might endure for speaking out. Loss of a job, a family member gets harassed, etc. Life could be made difficult just by being pointed out to others and essentially shunned. This is why I urge people from Steubenville to speak out over and over again. It should be obvious by now that even the media is realizing people in Steubenville are afraid to have their names associated with discussion of this case. It is the same reason people from town commented here using pseudonyms. Should there be a discussion as to why a town feels this way? I believe so, and hope that the DOJ is involved in this matter for just that reason.

      Reply
    2. BaronvSteuben

      I disagree to an extent on the ‘chilling effect’ going in in Steubenville. People are speaking their mind in public about the Rape case and what should happen in regards to the Steubenville High football program. What people are afraid of IMO, is ‘going on the record’ for the media. I’ve said my opinion about this case in public and haven’t felt any fear or retaliation. People may disagree with me on my position, but it hasn’t gone any further than that.

      Speaking to a newspaper reporter or television interviewer………..

      Reply
  50. C Morgan

    @ Kmac,
    I do concur your valid dispute of defendants claim on condition of JD. Acknowledged clearly in testimony of video reason, also used as lame excuse for another pic taken!

    While we’re at it… Enough with the giving her pass code to ph as any serious consideration! Noting attorney has leaked this to press.
    2 obvious problems with their theory on it holding weight.
    First, the “Jealous type”, ex BF Cody (mr. Conspirator) had prior knowledge of it. Their breakup only weeks before, I can’t see any reason she would think to change it bc of. They didn’t attend school together, or even live in same town. Nor would she have known it would be compromised in a rape by etc. Unless he’d made threats or she feared his retaliation, likely & somewhat established by Trent’s assurances, she need not worry re Cody! Hmm? But ph part in is not going to be a logical thought for her to have!
    Second the so-called security measures taken for (Sarcasm), was the SPACEBAR!!
    Anyone with an iPhone can imagine the real possibility, given that the large SPACEBAR is just above the main button, at the very edge of lower screen (TOUCH screen!).
    I can hover my thumb just above it, and in a motion of upward or either side swipe, <Button is engaged, without even making contact. As I just did there!
    So picture the phone. The circle main button brings it to life. you slide your thumb across the very bottom of the unlock bar that appears first, going fully across, left to right.
    Next the keypad would appear asking for pass code.
    So I take my thumb hovering above screen, just to the right of, from prior action, waiting for next immediate action…
    And ever so slightly move it to a more central position over keypad to enter- whatever… Guess what happens???
    I inadvertently have hit the space bar without even touching it and the screen springs to life! I am in!! Got lucky not even knowing it or trying!

    Morons would only try to use this as evidence!

    Plus we already know Cody was with them, having taken the unconscious carrying of pic. Thus the only purpose served in bringing this up, is to show they invaded her ph to delete any evidence, create false material, and to show they had possession of it= probable cause they were the one who stole it! As it did go missing for several days!
    Defense so-called supportive evidence, just became cause for prosecution that they had done something wrong, and were attempting to hide or destroy evidence!
    And also by claiming access to, they just devalued the alleged text claimed she sent exonerating Mays. The obvious can be pulled from some of what is here.
    Score 1 for the prosecution if they choose to debunk it as noted! Just saying.

    Reply
  51. C Morgan

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2293005/Ohio-rape-case-Teenage-girl-raped-humiliated-Ohio-footballers-photographed-fours.html

    1. Where is the flippin CD????? Start of doctoring case & cover-up! With added intimidation of victim and parent!
    2. Neeman is a slimeball, and someone should knock his teeth out for his comment! And while knowing both sides of details! Sick pervert! Disgusting. (Forgive the bluntness) I’d say it was evidence of his client getting ready or just after raping by intercourse, or sodomizing the victim! With the other an accomplice or a perpetrator of same!

    Reply
  52. PrinniesDoe

    Tears flowing for JD. Some are tears of joy that truth is coming out; mostly tears hearing what she went through! Much luv 2 her!

    Reply
  53. BaronvSteuben

    ‘Reno’ tweet ominous.

    Reply
  54. Elliot N

    Big Brother is “in the house”

    Reply
    1. JD#13

      Elliot N, do you mean what I think you mean?

      Reply
      1. prinnie (Post author)

        whoohooo!!!

        Reply
        1. C Morgan

          Perhaps they have been sitting back collecting evidence, building a case, and observing. Perhaps they gave them just enough rope to hang themselves. Perhaps they awaited trial to provide on official record, probable cause of wrongdoing… Thus grounds to now investigate. Bring in that bus, you’re going to need it!

          Reply
  55. ResoL411

    One could ALSO hope that Jane Hanlin is being DEEPLY investigated for her part in this.

    Reply
  56. baz0157

    So, I’ve been away for a while.. but have continued to watch the site and try to keep up with everything going on….After reading and hearing all the texts that were sent all I can say is WOW!! In the beginning everyone sided up on one side or the other…and I can understand standing up for your friends and family…but now after seeing all the texts alone, the people in this town that have been sticking up for the accused need to open their eyes and finally see what little monsters these kids are!!! They knew exactly what they were doing was wrong and now it is looking like they are in a downward spiral towards GUILTY!!

    Reply
  57. sicnangry

    @PrinniesDoe, Just like you I cried when I heard all this shit. Cried for the horrible things done to JD and cried for joy that all Prinnie has been saying since Aug. is finally coming out. I hope to god AG is watching and paying attention. He better do some serious investigating into Hanlin and company. School superintendent better get his ass in gear also. Reno Better fucking get his!! It is so hard to believe that these parents had no clue the kind of sick, perverted animals they have been raising. Now WTF does Steubenville Facts have to say??

    Reply
  58. BooBoo

    Snipped from The Daily Mail article

    August 12
    5.45pm
    Male friend: Are you all right? (Sent repeatedly until 6.37pm)
    06.39pm
    Victim: I’m good I need to find my phone tho and Trent went through my phone and looked at all our sh*t but what happened last night?
    F: You were like dead. Then they took you to Mark’s. I went there and left when I saw you naked on the ground. I seriously felt so bad for you and I couldn’t do sh*t about it. I’m so sorry.
    06.44pm
    V: WTF? Who was there? Who did that to me?
    F: The kids who you woke up with and Idk (I don’t know) you’ll have to ask them.
    V: You couldn’t have told them to stop or anything?
    F: You don’t think I did? I flipped out on them and they just said they were going to put you to bed and I don’t know what happened after that.
    V: Thanks. I hate my life. I don’t even know wtf happened.

    The following exchange takes place after the victim learns about a picture of her with semen on her stomach:
    9.08pm
    F: Do you remember anything from last night?
    V: I remember everything at Cammy’s (first party) then I remember walking out of the house and after that I don’t remember sh*t beside sitting in some road throwing up.
    F: That was Jake’s road and you were like dead in the middle of the road throwing up. It was terrible.
    V: OMG please tell me this isn’t f***ing true.
    F: WTF let me find out.
    V: OMG
    F: You ok?
    V: Not at all
    9.50pm
    F: You’ll be all right but I mean did you do anything at all with them? If you remember anything at all you have to tell me. I promise I won’t be mad.
    V: Swear to God I don’t remember doing anything with them because I didn’t feel good after throwing up. I passed out. I remember Trent telling me to do something but I said no.
    F: If there’s [semen] on you that’s f***ing crazy.
    V: Please find out.

    August 12: Between Trent and victim’s male friend (after male friend has spoken to the victim)
    F: You are a felon.
    TM: Not really.

    August 12: Between Trent Mays and his friend
    TM: 10.50.24pm ‘I should have raped her now cos everyone thinks I did.
    CS: Yeh you should.’

    August 13: Mays to is friend
    TM: ‘..I’m so fucking scared. Her dad knows and our names were brought up and listen if we get questioned she was really drunk so we took her to your house and took care of her.’

    August 13: To the victim’s father
    12.27am
    TM: ‘Sir this is Trent Mays this is all a big misunderstanding. She was at the party and we talked. She was really drunk. I never once tried to do anything forceful with your daughter and I’m sorry for all the trouble this has brought you.’
    Father: ‘What is on the video?’

    By the following day Mays’s seemed more confident after having spoken to his team football coach Reno Saccocio.

    In a text sent on August 14 he claimed: ‘I got Reno he took care of it an ain’t shit gonna happen even if they did take it to court.’Mays sat, blank faced and flanked by his attorneys as these words were read out at the trial slated to run until the weekend.

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2293596/OMG-Please-tell-isnt-true-The-horrifying-moment-Ohio-footballers-rape-victim-discovers-TEXT-happened-passed-drunken-night.html#ixzz2NZ3HqW00
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      August 12: Between Trent Mays and his friend
      TM: 10.50.24pm ‘I should have raped her now cos everyone thinks I did.
      CS: Yeh you should.’

      I believe this particular blog is VERY FAMILIAR with that individual. SICKENING!!!!

      Reply
      1. PrinniesDoe

        Is this the BF that was talking to JD telling her he would find out what happened? Then this text took place between him and Trent?

        Reply
        1. prinnie (Post author)

          I believe that the one texting her is AC. TM had gone through JD’s phone to look for texts from AC because he heard they had been texting.

          Reply
          1. PrinniesDoe

            Got it. My gut still is tellin me that the org. story on how this whole thing got started is the real story. Anyone else have the same thought?

          2. prinnie (Post author)

            Yep…sure do. The fact that the coach and parents knew what happened by the next day is despicable, and THEN vilify others for daring to speak of corruption and protection of a football program? Just wow!

          3. C Morgan

            Can you please pass the Salt, man?
            Assume you are ref Mr. Conspirator? If so, One only has to consider his original comments weeks prior to know “who done it!.” the jerk with the broadcasted motive.
            Just Add his actions & comments that night, and after. He was the one that sent awful image/txt to the mom, yes? And the one above here quoted.
            he is a sick, twisted, vindictive, manipulativ, & evil POS! Yet He is also a coward, bc he uses others to do his sadistic work for him. And yet he roams the streets free, looking for his next target & victim! Why?

    2. BaronvSteuben

      With that tweet by Mays, AG’s Office will be hardpressed not to conduct a further investigation into Obstructing Justice.

      Reply
      1. prinnie (Post author)

        If Craig recants testimony, and then invokes the Fifth – do you think that they can still prosecute him?

        Reply
        1. BaronvSteuben

          IMO yes. Remember, DeWine made no deal with Cole, Westlake and Craig. No deal; no protection from prosecution.

          I believe the prosecutor could still get in the testimony of Craig, Cole and Westlake if they took 5 under Evidence Rule 804(B)(1). Since they were under oath and subject to cross-examination their testimony at said hearing could (subject to Judge Lipps) be admitted into evidence since they would be unavailable by taking the 5th. Here’s a line to Evid. R 804:

          http://www.sconet.state.oh.us/LegalResources/Rules/evidence/evidence.pdf

          Reply
          1. BaronvSteuben

            The hearing would be the probable cause hearing held in October.

          2. prinnie (Post author)

            I read that someone will be recanting testimony. If it is AC who recants does recanting prevent him from a previous perjured statement?

        2. haradanohime

          If I remember correctly wasn’t AC the one who went State’s witness willingly? I remember reading one of them did. And if so I can see the AAG being a bit more lienient with him in the long run.

          Reply
  59. BaronvSteuben

    It’s also fair to say the amount of damaging tweets presented today in court blows the law enforcement coverup theory out of the water.

    Reply
    1. ResoL411

      How so? Just because that bungling Barney Fife couldn’t get the stuff deleted, doesn’t mean an attempt by them and Ole Miss Hanlin wasn’t tried. This entire thing stinks…and from so many directions.

      Reply
      1. BaronvSteuben

        It was those ‘Barney Fife’s’ who recovered the phones, interviewed witnesses leading to the arrest of Mays and Richmond, and getting the testimony of Craig, Cole and Westlake, There would no case to be had against Mays and Richmond without their work.

        Reply
        1. C Morgan

          I disagree. I think it’s more of a pick and choose on good cops, bad cops need applied here. Too much evidence was destroyed or vanished.
          They should have advised JD to get a hair follicle test to ensure no drugs were in her system. (This includes rohypnol up to a month post ingestion.)
          someone tipped off warrants were coming.
          I have a huge problem local LE was used to sift through the data pulled from phones. Much of texts & posts can be open for interpretation by the reader. Crucial ones easily could have been overlooked, misinterpreted, either inadvertently or by choice.
          History speaks for itself. And History repeats.
          Ignore other crimes by these kids regularly occurs.
          Where in the hell is that CD, last in a cop’s hand?
          Failure to obtain phone records with pings.
          Failure to arrest obvious accomplices, etc. Plenty of probable cause.
          Failures in interrogations. BCI had to go behind bc they claimed no witnesses were coming forward?
          Failure to accept FBI’s offer to pull digital evidence, they and CGI were unable to do so.
          And of here, those that could attest to their odd behavior towards some supporters of JD. Friend to foe. Even with initial coming to defense of their actions professionally.
          Discounting all social media from start. Failing to use in investigation.
          Failure to obtain deleted images known of, and videos from Twitter, Instagram, YouTube (main data files of all originals.)
          The far too convenient recovery of only certain digital evidence incriminating only a certain 2, and with the bare minimum on what.
          Further names of should be suspects, to some degree… may still surface.
          Family connections to, and of those, not charged and yet should be on some counts.
          The sheriff contradicting himself at nearly every turn.

          These are some of the biggies discussed prior. But certain others could add to.
          There is solid reasons, more than just some, fear or don’t trust local LE.
          So no not all are included. But I’m sure those of with integrity, choose to stay silent for a reason.

          Reply
  60. tonislost

    As stated before many a time on here and other such sites, get all the kids invoved and the ones that watched and did nothing, the parents who opened their homes to these sicko “parties,” the parents who knew and did nothing, city, cnty, state officials, who, yes, tried to cover it up, the school board that did nothing, school officials who did less than nothing, and coaches who berated the victim, threatened others and their families, and as it looks (allegedly,allegedly allegedly) took part in trying spare these thugs what they are now getting. Time coming very soon for all to reap the consequences of their failed morally vacant lives. Do we forgive, yes, our Faith requires forgiveness, do we forget, never.

    Reply
  61. Alchemist

    @BaronvSteuben March 14, 2013 at 8:55 pm

    With that tweet by Mays, AG’s Office will be hardpressed not to conduct a further investigation into Obstructing Justice.

    Indeed. Now that Coach Reno has been named specifically, this is going to open-up a real can of worms. For starters, Reno’s going to have to resign as a Mediator in the Juvenile Court system; he’ll also have to resign (or be fired) as Coach. There will have to be a thorough investigation — how many other football players has he covered-up for? All the Juvenile Court cases involving him may have to be reviewed to ensure that there is nothing amiss. At the very least Reno has violated the mandatory reporting rules — how many others at Steubenville High School have done the same thing? They may have to fire the entire Athletic staff.

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      The AD will be retiring at the end of the school year. I can’t see the assistant football coaches surviving if Saccoccia goes under these circumstances.

      Reply
    2. BooBoo

      I would think Reno would automatically be fired from both positions due to failing to report!

      Reply
      1. BaronvSteuben

        I believe he can; but right now the only evidence supporting this allegation is tweets from Mays and Craig. We have nothing directly from Saccoccia nor any independent evidence that substantiates this allegation……yet

        Reply
        1. prinnie (Post author)

          Do you think they will call Reno to testify?

          Reply
          1. BaronvSteuben

            My guess is no. Unless you already have information (ie. a statement to law enforcement) that you have that can pin him down on examination you wouldn’t want to put him up.

            Law School 101: Never ask a question to a witness at trial you don’t already know the answer to.

          2. C Morgan

            I vote no… If there is intent to prosecute him after the trial. Or at a minimum, start an intense investigation into. Doing so could compromise prosecution of later. Probable cause is a good thing here.
            Besides, He would more than likely plead the 5th, and be applied correctly. Or what if the judge granted him immunity in exchange for testifying Trent confessed to him!? Admitting to any part of the texts, or knowledge of the rape and cover-up, would be incriminating himself in a crime.
            Why risk giving him an opportunity to manipulate the legal system, to benefit himself later.

  62. BaronvSteuben

    To Prinnie:if the AG’s Office can prove his previous testimony was in fact perjured, they can use any other (non-sworn) evidence to proved the same.

    Does this relate to his answer to Walter Madison regarding the naked pictures on his cellphone, or other acts he may have actually been involved in that night?

    Reply
  63. C Morgan

    http://m.theatlanticwire.com/national/2013/03/steubenville-friday-night-lights-scenario-playing-out-horrible-ways/63126/
    Another good sum it up article. My heart broke again for this poor girl. And my disgust only grew for those who did this! And absolute horror and anger intensifies at those being exposed for trying to sabatoge the case! Redemption granted on a remote scale to any witnesses who take this opportunity to be forthcoming with the whole truth.
    Only a fool would dispute the obvious, and it only confirms my gut of guilt from first reading of this case. They should be in adult court charged with 1st degree rape! And more should follow!
    I’m just glad to see MSM starting to acknowledge the coverup, and that others likely may have assaulted her too! Yet I hate that aspect of for her sake.

    Reply
  64. Elliot N

    YES

    Reply
  65. Elliot N

    He could be prosecuted yes

    Reply
  66. Stan

    My heart goes out to JD – I cannot believe the horror of what happened to her. I’m heartened that law enforcement appears to have been doing their job — the text exchanges are even more damning than anyone could have imagined. The football coach who clearly helped cover up his players actions and every single kid who attended any of the parties on that awful August night, saw the assault taking place and *didnt* call the police deserves to be prosecuted for aiding and abetting a crime.

    Reply
  67. BooBoo

    Mays texted to Anthony Craig that Saccoccia “took care of it. Nothing is going to happen.”

    Mays texted to a female that Saccoccia had told him those involved have to stay in for a week and they will be suspended for three games the next time, testimony indicated. “But I felt he took care of it.”

    http://www.hsconnect.com/page/content.detail/id/584266.html

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      But the school administration allowed Reno to “take care of it”. Surely they also knew what went down. ALL OF THEM need to be held accountable.

      Reply
    2. BooBoo

      So do I have this right in this article it says Reno told Mays he had to stay in for a week and the next time he would be suspended for 3 games? WTF is wrong with this old coot??? Seriously slapping him on the wrist making him “stay in for a week” but “next time” he will get suspended for 3 days??

      Reply
      1. prinnie (Post author)

        Yep, that’s the gist of it. He took care of it.

        Reply
        1. maddgramma

          Hello Friend! Well, gee who are they going to blame now? They abused you for the last 7 months and called you everything they wanted and of course you were raining on their parade! Well, I hope all their eyes have opened up and they can see that all the hard work you did was to only get to the truth for Jane Doe. I know i’ve asked you before but, please don’t stop what you do. You are amazing and you helped so many of us with nothing but true facts. Thank You! I for one am honored to be in your life and I Thank You for all you did for all of us Does. Hopefully, soon we can go out for that cup of coffee! Justice For Jane Doe

          Reply
  68. Elliot N

    Cant have anything like a little ole rape and sodomy of an underage girl mess up the football season “Roll Big Red”. The collective lack of moral conscience in this event is sickening. And yet they worry about people wearing masks WTF

    Reply
  69. jeanne711

    What is really upsetting here is that these boys…not just the 2 on trial, but all of the others also…think they are blameless in anything that they do because someone will always cover it up or pay it off. There is just no moral thinking of any of them for this reason. And all of the ones that just stood by and let this happen also have no morals. I wonder why none of the girls stood up for her or maybe they are just so used to this thing happening it didn’t mean anything to them. I wish and pray that all of the other girls that this happened to would bring this to the forefront and realize that rape is rape!!!

    Reply
  70. Elliot N

    JD#13 Safe to say that the fallout from this event could become far reaching, time will tell

    Reply
  71. Alchemist

    @prinnie
    March 14, 2013 at 11:14 pm

    Yep, that’s the gist of it. He took care of it.

    And, from all appearances, it would appear that the School Board are taking care of him in return.

    “Saccoccia has not commented about the allegations, and Steubenville school officials have refused to make him available. Phone and email messages were left after hours for Superintendent Michael McVey … ”

    http://www.newser.com/article/da518ouo2/teen-girl-in-ohio-rape-case-told-friend-she-didnt-remember-night-was-taken-advantage-of.html

    Reply
  72. Elliot N

    I wonder if we will be seeing any more of those long winded Letters To The Editor defending the “integrity” of those in positions of authority from any hypothetical local good ole boy lawyer with too much time on his hands?

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Lol! Lets just hope he’s too busy defending his vocal actions & ethics… He is an assistant PA. He did have a private meeting with JH and Ofc R investigating the case in the first days of. Testified to in PC hearing. Makes him a part to the case, and privy to details of an active case investigation. Just saying!

      Reply
  73. sicnangry

    What’s Cathy D going to say on Steubenville Facts now? She better quit while she’s ahead. Her town is TOAST. If Reno isn’t fired or resigns that school has no hope!! Madonna fired their winning baseball coach because he got a DUI. I’ll bet Reno and Hanlin aren’t sleeping to well tonight. Did anyone see interview with Madison yesterday after court adjourned? NHerbick asked him about picture of nude JD and defendants and he said something like this (I swear to God) : “Well when we do something in the dark night and when we do stupid things in the dark of night and then they come out …Well then we are sorry.” That man does not have both oars in the water. NHerbick said judge appeared to be listening “very closely” to the texts today. I’ve got to have faith that he will see the lies when defendants testify. What will today bring? Why would AC (if it is him) recant now?

    Reply
  74. BooBoo

    Later Thursday, long after the reading of the texts left the court shocked and aghast, a final witness of the night was called. It was nearly 8 p.m. and Steubenville’s downtown was dark and desolate, but the prosecution wanted to get Shawn McGhee, an 18-year-old local who is currently a freshman at Campbellsville University in Kentucky, where he is on the wrestling team.

    McGhee is Richmond’s cousin. He called Mays “one of my best friends.” When asked by special prosecutor Marianne Hemmeter how it felt to be a witness against people he’s so close to, McGhee said, simply: “It hurts.”

    Yet McGhee, who was still in town last August before heading off to college, testified thate he saw the girl at a party earlier in the night. He believed, based on her slurring words and stumbling walk, that she was extremely drunk. So later in the evening, when the initial texts and pictures and rumors began flying about what Mays and Richmond were allegedly doing with her, he became enraged.

    This, he knew, was wrong. So he borrowed a friend’s phone (his was out of power) and texted the following to Mays:

    “This is Shawn, you are dead wrong. I’m going to choke the [expletive] out of you for that. You could go to jail for life for that. What the [expletive]. Shawn McGhee.”

    Hemmeter asked McGhee why he sent that and other accusatory, confrontational texts to Mays.

    “I saw how drunk she was,” he said.

    And with that, at last, there was at least a single teenager in Steubenville sending a single text that suggested someone finally had the slightest bit of perspective, morals or manhood to do or say a damn thing.

    At last, after a long, long day of court, after two days of testimony, after all this evidence – all this “[expletive] the dead girl” and “piss on the dead girl” and LOL after LOL – finally, there was a single beacon of feel-good hope in this entire cesspool of a story.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/news/highschool–steubenville-suspects–text-messages-paint-disturbing-picture-of-night-of-alleged-rape–according-to-prosecutors-053236470.html

    WTG Shawn McGhee!!!

    Reply
  75. prinnie (Post author)

    Yes, he deserves some recognition for being the ONLY person that night with an ounce of compassion.

    Reply
  76. John Lewis

    I know this may seem a callous matter to bring up at this time but it is hugely important that the whole football program (NOT the whole town, there are still plenty of decent people there, just the football program) is not only punished but visibly shamed.

    Once the verdicts are announced the other schools scheduled to play Big Red in 2013 will have to say if they will be going ahead with those fixtures – and say it pretty damned quickly.

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      The schools that have a K with Steubenville will either have to play the game of break the K and pay Big Red $ (if Steubenville won’t let them out).

      Reply
  77. John Doe #13

    Well, John, I disagree that the football team should be shamed (maybe because I have children who are in the youth system and have nothing but good things to say about their coaches from my personal experiences)but what you say is starting to happen.

    Big Red generally has their schedule filled by now and, last I heard, they only had 4-5 games scheduled. Inkster High School in Michigan refused to play them here or there. Morgantown isn’t playing them, either.

    To go even further, the Tigers (Big Red’s youth team) was forced to leave the Steel Valley league here due to the uproar from other teams. They now joined a league that is based out of Youngstown. Which means I will now have the privelage of driving 3 hours round trip when they have an away game. And this is all directed at 8-12 year olds who have absolutely nothing to do with all this.

    My oldest’s best friend wrestles and was heckled and called “little rapist” at a tournament in Wheeling he recently competed at.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      And the blame for this lies on those who brought the shame to their town. It has affected everyone. It is sad all the way around.

      Reply
    2. John Lewis

      I’m sorry to be brutal #13 but maybe you should be grateful that the endemic behavior of at least some of the football team is being brought to light before your children ran the risk of becoming part of it.

      I have no doubt many parents of the current players also had nothing but good things to say about the coaches.

      Direct your anger at those responsible for making your town the subject of worldwide disgust.

      Reply
  78. baz0157

    Witness pleads the 5th….Judge then grants immunity for his testimony….originally, prosecutors office denied giving immunity…is this now their way of covering up the original immunity granted? funny how stuff always comes out!!!

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      No. Only judge, not a prosecutor can grant immunity. Defense objected to the granting of immunity.

      Reply
      1. baz0157

        Thank you, I was wondering if they were granted immunity all along and this was their way of finally getting it out there.

        Reply
        1. BaronvSteuben

          The granting of immunity helps the AG’s case, therefore JD.

          Reply
  79. Alchemist

    @John Lewis March 15, 2013 at 5:52 am
    I know this may seem a callous matter to bring up at this time but it is hugely important that the whole football program (NOT the whole town, there are still plenty of decent people there, just the football program) is not only punished but visibly shamed.

    Once the verdicts are announced the other schools scheduled to play Big Red in 2013 will have to say if they will be going ahead with those fixtures – and say it pretty damned quickly.

    I think this would be an excellent start. I’d also like to see the Ohio High School Athletic Association (OHSAA) suspend the Steubenville football program, making them ineligible to play any other teams. I think there’s an excellent chance that this will happen if Coach Reno is not fired, or forced to resign.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      It no doubt would be a very stern message to others thinking of covering for their friends and not doing the right thing. The sad part of this is Reno has probably instilled in these guys that they stick together and come to him to “take care of it”.

      Reply
  80. Alchemist

    According to the WTRF7 News twitter feed:

    BREAKING: Steubenville High School football coach Reno Saccoccia will testify today.

    Reply
  81. haradanohime

    If reported correctly I think they were only granted Immunity for Failure to report a Crime. But there could be other charges pressed against the, as well as a civil suit.

    Reply
  82. Alchemist

    It will be interesting indeed to see of Coach Reno takes the 5th or not.

    Reply
    1. Timmeh

      Interesting that he apparently is called by the prosecution AFAIK.

      The ramifications IF Saccoccia’s testimony assists the prosecution may be very interesting with respect to the various allegations of coverup and dilatory investigating.

      It just may that be the bus is driving past and the coach needs to decide if he wants to jump under it or not. If you get my drift.

      Reply
  83. Alchemist

    BaronvSteuben March 15, 2013 at 11:35 am

    The schools that have a K with Steubenville will either have to play the game of break the K and pay Big Red $ (if Steubenville won’t let them out).

    Baron, would these contracts still be in force if the OHSAA pulls Stubenville’s membership?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      No.

      Reply
      1. Alice

        Good. I hope OHSAA pulls their membership.

        Reply
        1. C Morgan

          Folks over at the message boards connected to, have been demanding just that, among questioning why no investigations have started, etc… For months. I believe the association has tried to play neutral, citing no grounds on books for… ?

          Reply
  84. Timmeh

    I haven’t had much to say lately, but look forward to the details of Reno Saccoccia’s testimony today. Step carefully coach. Several questions that I will ask now.

    1. Is Reno Saccoccia an Ohio Mandated Reporter?

    2. If he is, what did he report, who was the report made to, when was the report made?

    Some reference material from the Ohio Education Association under Teachers and Children’s Services Investigations.

    TEACHERS DUTY TO REPORT TO CHILDREN SERVICES

    Ohio Revised Code Section 2151.421 (Key Provisions)

    A.1. (a) — Duty to Report
    Persons in certain official positions who know or suspect that abuse or neglect has occurred to a child under eighteen (18) or mentally retarded, developmentally disabled or physically impaired child under age twenty-one (21) shall immediately report that knowledge or suspicion to the county public children services agency or the municipal or county peace officer in the county in which the child lives.

    A.1. (b) — People Required to Report
    Total of twenty-two (22) are listed including licensed school psychologist, speech pathologist, or audiologist, school teacher, school employee, or school authority.

    G.1 — Immunity for Making Report
    Persons making the report or participating in the investigation IN GOOD FAITH are immune from civil or criminal liability.

    Ohio Supreme Court Decision: Campbell v. Burton (imposing individual liability for failure to perform duty to report known or suspected child abuse)

    In Campbell v. Burton, decided on July 25, 2001, the Ohio Supreme Court ruled that a school teacher and her school district could be sued for the teacher’s negligent failure to report her knowledge or suspicion of child abuse to the public children services agency of the jurisdiction.1 In so holding, the Supreme Court reversed the decisions of lower courts that had relied on Ohio’s sovereign immunity law to dismiss lawsuits against teachers and school boards alleging negligent failure to report child abuse.2 The Court held that the abuse reporting statute expressly imposes liability on the individuals designated as mandatory reporters, and thereby creates an exception to sovereign immunity for the teacher and school district. The decision therefore opens the door to lawsuits against school teachers should they have knowledge of possible child abuse and fail to report such knowledge to the appropriate children services agency.

    The decision does not expand the mandatory duty of school teachers to report knowledge or suspicion of child abuse; these laws have existed for many years. In this regard, teachers already face the possibility of criminal liability for failure to report suspected child abuse.3 The Ohio Supreme Court also noted that individuals who report suspicions of child abuse in good faith are granted immunity from civil and criminal liability pursuant to R.C. §2151.421(G). By granting broad immunity to individuals who report suspicions of child abuse in good faith, the law encourages reporters to err on the side of disclosure in all instances of suspected child abuse.

    The decision increases the likelihood of teachers becoming defendants in lawsuits where a third party is the actual child abuser, and the teacher has failed to report her suspicion of abuse. OEA members should be aware that boards of education have a duty to defend and indemnify teachers and other employees from such lawsuits under R.C. §2744.07. Even though school districts have a duty to defend and indemnify employees from such lawsuits, teachers and support staff will still face the burden of litigation, including time and inconvenience required to participate in litigation. The best advice to give teachers and support staff is to always err on the side of disclosure of suspected child abuse to the appropriate children services agency.

    1School teachers have a mandatory duty to report knowledge or suspicion of child abuse pursuant to §2151.421(A) of the Ohio Revised Code.
    2Ohio’s sovereign immunity statute provides: “In a civil action brought against a political subdivision or an employee of a political subdivision to recover damages for injury, death, or loss to property allegedly caused by any act or omission in connection with a governmental or proprietary function . . . the employee is immune from liability unless one of the following applies: (a) His acts or omissions were manifestly outside the scope of his employment or official responsibilities; (b) His acts or omissions were with malicious purpose, in bad faith, or in a wanton or reckless manner; or (c) Liability is expressly imposed by a section of the Revised Code.”
    3A violation of R.C. §2151.421(A), i.e. the failure of a mandated reporter such as a school teacher to report known or suspected child abuse, is a fourth-degree misdemeanor.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Very valid! But let’s be real, he wasn’t going to jeopardize his teams performance… He benefits far too lavishly from the booster club, no! Alleged to have bought him a house, car, trips…
      Can clearly see why that old club isn’t following IRS registration and audit guidelines, huh! And per one source that claimed to know for a fact, the infamous country club vandalism was paid off by, to a tune of 50k. The vandals? CK, among them.
      So it doesn’t seem far fetched that a far more team affecting crime, is going to be covered up at all costs!

      Reply
  85. Timmeh

    An editorial in today’s Christian Science Monitor. The headline reads:

    “Steubenville, Ohio, rape and India gang rape show India isn’t so ‘backward’

    Indian reaction to the New Delhi gang rape is in many ways more promising than American reactions to US rapes. Take the Steubenville, Ohio, case, which hasn’t generated the same public outrage as the case in India. Indian protesters’ calls for justice are a heartening sign of progress.”

    http://www.csmonitor.com/Commentary/Opinion/2013/0315/Steubenville-Ohio-rape-and-India-gang-rape-show-India-isn-t-so-backward

    Reply
  86. Timmeh

    Speculation, and IANAL but

    If I had to make a prediction it would be that Saccoccia is called by the prosecution, during the course of testimony the prosecutor asks to treat the witness as a hostile witness, to which the court acceeds on a limited basis after objections by the defense.

    Reply
  87. ballard

    Thank you Prinniefied blog and all the posters for research and attention to this Steubenville rape trial.
    It is truly amazing to see how much is uncovered and I hope that justice is served soon. I shudder to think how vile the defense and slander could now be against Jane Doe, they basically have little hope left and they will now keep on the strategy of trial through media which they have been playing out this week (after the juvenile non-punishment they may get).

    Please lets not overly congratulate Shawn McGee for doing one good (normal) in texts. He may be on social media now trying to get support for Trent Mays and Malik Richmond:

    shawn m ‏@ohso_shawn
    “Wishing the best for Trent and Malik! RT if you’re with #teamMalikandTrent”

    Is there no one but Jane Doe that is worthwile …I’m joking! Thank you again

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      I wish he would have actually done something. If anyone would have done something — we wouldn’t be talking about this for sure. Why no tweet from him about wishing the best from Jane Doe? Sad, huh?

      Reply
    2. C Morgan

      I share your skepticism! Not impressed, having just recently studied & then pointed out his actions in video! See below Re. Addressed.

      Reply
  88. ballard

    Absolutely, his one moment of texting about rape was not really about caring for Jane Doe but more concern about how badly this could reflect on his boy. I have dm’d his twitter, do not want to give attention for his ‘trending’ by tweeting him. Some are still tweeting and they are still imbeciles.

    As a mother of two boys, one of which randomly is showing “promise” in sports (truly I have no idea and its not anything of my interest, bless) this culture around ‘masculinity’ and ‘team’, even without rape, sexual abuse, violence, can be problematic if it sanctions authorities to act in the best interests in the team rather than the individual. Its complicated but that is part of any good education system. What is revealed is about entrenched are the terrible viewpoints of the parents and educators in Steubenville.

    Justice to brave and beautiful Jane Doe, I truly hope she does not need to testify, but we are here for her to. x Thanks all.

    Reply
  89. C Morgan

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2294089/Drunken-dead-girl-raped-Ohio-footballers-Witness-quizzed-infamous-YouTube-video-partygoers-laughing-16-year-old-assaulted.html
    Ok so it was SM as discussed of video, and he did alleged clearly in, was heading to Coles house near video end! Omitted in PC testimony of coming over! So who else???
    And was it his hand in the photo? Still a crime! Didn’t alert any parents or police if he had such problems with it! I’m not impressed by his Dave face after texts! Sorry!
    And I want to know if he was the voice behind “train. Trains coming!”?? Right b4 rising to head over, coming into frame.
    Nodi had been just there, no?
    Why were certain people missing from story on their presence at?????? Tells me we still don’t have the ” hole” story!

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      *save face/ not Dave!
      Btw as a former AF spouse, I have a problem with the character of Mr. Driver joining! Military has enough issues with similar sexual conduct. Am I wrong here? Should attention be “called” to? I’m considering myself biased just a bit.

      Reply
  90. C Morgan

    I predict Reno pleads the 5th. Judge grants him immunity. He’s in the clear by state! He then goes on to “lie till you die” & “lie to the grave” anyway! A/o throws Trent under bus that he was lying, or misunderstood.
    Don’t forget this info should have long ago been addressed by officials! Local Police, PA ofc, AG Ofc, school board & Mcwaldo… Had a responsibility to protect other children from his influences. McWaldo & board should lose jobs based upon too. When he chose to not take action of reprimand, given against protocol he was granted full reigns regarding! So instead he tries to cover it up! Only problem they got caught… This time! But next time I’m going to bench u 3 games, the horror! For rape. Thx though for establishing this is nothing new to team traditions!
    And here we have a cover up ontop a cover up, to protect coach, team record & season! Sick!

    Reply
  91. C Morgan

    Another problem:
    Haven’t read much addressing Farrah’s presence @ Coles. Call it girl code or basic principle… But she is the 1 person of all there, that should have intervened, called someone, etc! But no she was more concerned about skanking around with BF Mark! Spending the night with?! did her parents allow this? Based upon the going standards of the other parents of, probably with their blessing!
    She should be charged as an assessory, or accomplice to, failure to report a felony in progress. Disgusting display of character!

    Seems the first 2 boys that testified in probable cause hearing, were granted trial immunity, in-spite of them proving themselves not credible before!? 1. Lied by omission who was at MC’s, & stayed night. 2. Lied to the condition of JD’s state & clothing… in street, car, & at house! 3. Then there was little things like who went downstairs, when, how JD got down to basement. Downplaying what occured to her…
    So given their immunity back then wasn’t really granted, conveniently they give it to them officially!!? Prior perjury clearly evident!? Why would their distorted testimony (matching in lies) be even of any value??
    But guess what happens? They now escape charges!! Funny how that worked out!
    I call yet another BS!

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Yet missing still is the evidence of Ping, ping, ping, & pings!?=who, when, & where. Why is that???
      The deleted images & videos & tweets? Said to be stored with all other original data @ Twitter/Library of Congress, Instagram, and YouTube. Maybe even resting on a “cloud”. Or perhaps synced to their home PCs hard-drives, iPads, etc…
      Truly lame.

      Reply
  92. UncleRay

    The defendant also texted, “I’m about to snap. You were right … She was passed out.”

    http://www.cleveland.com/steubenville-rape-case/index.ssf/2013/03/steubenville_rape_case_trial_e.html

    Reply
  93. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

    OK, I get it. I was that young once and my friends and I did foolish things, such as having too much to drink and flirting inappropriately with guys we didn’t know well. We were fortunate that we were not ever mistreated in any way. But, JD’s being drunk is being misused by the defense as an excuse for the boys’ criminal behavior, because she knowingly left the first party with the boys after being advised not to leave, by her ex-friend. If I am drunk and place myself in a vulnerable position with someone I thought I could trust and he beats me up or murders me, or even just robs me, am I responsible for his crimes because I made them easier to commit? Hell, no! Would any right minded individual mistreat or harm someone for simply being vulnerable?

    I am sooo pissed off! Just read on twitter accounts that defense is implying through expert witness on alcohol effects, that JD could have given consent and still have been too drunk to remember. My question: Consent to WHAT? Various boys treating her like a toy, humiliating her, filming her and using derogatory terms for her to amuse themselves, and possibly urinating on her? Has ANYONE ever given informed consent to THAT?

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Awesome argument there on responsibility for others criminal conduct!
      This is true on expert witness, I watched her testimony & just gave as much detail re on other page. It was down right absurd! Prosecution did an ok job on putting some holes in it. Guess left to judge to consider or not. Pissed the prosecution expert went dead on feed, was just getting interesting!

      Reply
  94. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

    I want to also add that I do not believe Jane Doe, or anyone else, would have knowingly consented to any of what we’ve heard was done to her after she left that first party.

    It is apparent that she may have had a trusting friendship and even an attraction to the horrid Trent Mays, but she made clear in her texts that she expected him to protect her, and she was hurt by his callous disregard for what happened that night.

    Mays desperately texted her to prevent the case from effecting his role on the stupid football team!

    Reply
  95. Alchemist

    Yet anothe clusterfuck… due to a witness apparently saying the victim’s name, the judge has ordered an end to live streaming of the trial until the end. You know, I could have sworn I heard the prosecutor mention her name on the first day.

    The various networks have spent a literal ton of money putting in satellite trucks and the like to cover this trial, to end up with virtually NO usable coverage. I’m beginning to smell a rat.

    Reply
    1. sicnangry

      Live feed back up state has given final argument, Mays att. gave his and now richmonds is giving his. wtrf7 is saying judge may have a ruling tonight. I couldn’t stand watching and listening to Madison’s closing arguments anymore. I turned it off. Victim blaming and saying the other 3 pigs lied against his client.

      Reply
      1. prinnie (Post author)

        The other three IMO have not told the truth. Their statements to police changed, their testimony from probable cause hearing changed. They are all liars. IMHO

        Reply
        1. sicnangry

          I didn’t read the pc transcripts. Eric Minor said yesterday their testimony stayed the same. I believed him. My bad! I thought state had 28 witnesses. Where did they go?

          Reply
  96. NA

    Eric Minor ‏just tweeted “Jane Doe’s cross exam testimony absolves JeffCo Prosecutor’s son. JD says lots of names were mentioned in early med report at hosp.” Thoughts?

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      It confirms the early whispers about his involvement, but not to the extent. I’m floored about the EW info in closing arguments. WOW! And he would not submit to a DNA swab…WHY?

      Reply
  97. Alchemist

    Selected highlights of the victim’s testimony today:

    Laurie Conway ‏@LConwayWTRF
    She testified defendant told her that Reno called his house and said that he and other defendant raped her. Told her to tell her dad (1/2)
    https://twitter.com/LConwayWTRF/status/313038301852487680

    Laurie Conway ‏@LConwayWTRF
    (2/2) the truth. She responded that video pics and social media were telling her what happened.
    https://twitter.com/LConwayWTRF/status/313038401291034624

    Laurie Conway ‏@LConwayWTRF
    The last thing I heard before leaving media room was a text that defendant sent to victim that this was going to cause him to get (1/2)
    https://twitter.com/LConwayWTRF/status/313039675877113856

    Laurie Conway ‏@LConwayWTRF
    (2/2) kicked off his football team. Victim says she told him to stop saying that bc that’s all he cared about. He said “it needs to be(cont)
    https://twitter.com/LConwayWTRF/status/313039965711896576

    Laurie Conway ‏@LConwayWTRF
    Taken care of first.”
    https://twitter.com/LConwayWTRF/status/313040002625961984

    Reply
  98. sicnangry

    What happened to the great Reno testifying? And I thought Nodianos was testifying. I’m glad he didn’t. He just would have pled the 5th. Maybe now they can charge him with something. Defense’s expert witness on alcohol was a joke. She was so stupid. The only thing that disappointed me about her testimony was why didn’t state hit her hard when they cross examined her. State just gave there final closing. Judge said he will give decision tomorrow at !0 am.

    Reply
  99. Rose7

    Well, now everyone knows her name. Why does it seem to me the arguments here were, “This is just what today’s young adults do, so why are we taking up this Court’s time”?

    Reply
  100. sicnangry

    The made sure everyone knew her name this afternoon during defense’s expert witness testimony and prosecution also used her name. Judge asked Madison not to say her name in closing arguements and he did anyway. The state gave a rebuttal to Madison’s closing (calling everyone Liars), so hopefully the judge will be able to see who was really lying. I wasn’t watching everything today, did the defendants testify?

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      That was very intentional! He should be reprimanded in some way. Also it was suggested the earlier name dropping was on purpose bc JD was due to testify upcoming… To razzle her before taking the stand.

      Reply
  101. Alchemist

    @sicnangry March 16, 2013 at 8:32 pm

    The made sure everyone knew her name this afternoon during defense’s expert witness testimony and prosecution also used her name. Judge asked Madison not to say her name in closing arguements and he did anyway. The state gave a rebuttal to Madison’s closing (calling everyone Liars), so hopefully the judge will be able to see who was really lying. I wasn’t watching everything today, did the defendants testify?

    There wasn’t much point in watching, frankly. I think that just 2 of the 22+ witnesses agreed to be recorded — it was an absolute travesty.

    Reply
  102. sicnangry

    Any chance AG wanted this over so Feds or DOJ can take over? When I dream, I dream Big!!

    Reply
  103. C Morgan

    No they did not take the stand.
    Couple questions, the hospital she was sent to, isn’t by chance the same one JH worked for, and FB firm represents is it? Anyone connected to the Dr or nurse who encouraged her to not get rape kit? Just wondering.


    Also this text I found interesting but not of much mention in what happened or may have that night…?

    n a text sent later that morning the witness described the ‘victim’ as ‘basically dead.’
    >> He went on: ‘They were feeding her alcohol like it was water all night long.’

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2294340/Key-witness-Ohio-rape-trial-admits-sending-text-fellow-student-saying-Bro-going-rape-girl-tonight.html#ixzz2NkX0Melh

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      C Morgan, that is the first time I’ve seen something suggesting the Crew were seen deliberately trying to get J.D. unconscious or at least too drunk to resist an assault. If she was continually “fed” alcohol, has this come up anywhere before? It seems rather pivotal in shooting down some of the defense case, especially what Madison drew out of the testimony by ex-friends of J.D, who criticized her drinking.

      Reply
    2. BaronvSteuben

      C Morgan; the hospital Jane Doe treated at was Weirton Medical Center. No professional connection with the prosecuting attorney or Bruzzese firm. That is Trinity Medical Center in Steubenville.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        Thx. There was also rumors of who works in hospital. I think the nurse & dr should be liable for encouraging her not to get the rape kit. Completely irresponsible. No memory is cause for concern enough. Especially adding waking in a strange house unclothed!

        Reply
        1. BaronvSteuben

          I’m surprised the doctor didn’t try. It might have been a longshot, but when someone comes to you and believed they had been raped why not see if you can collect anything useable.

          Reply
          1. C Morgan

            Exactly. I read the notes on report. There was enough information to be suspect of the real possibility existing. Multiple males involved and rumors/social media already circulating. I read the nurse talked her out of, and then the dr backed it up?
            For medical reasons I’d have insisted my child have it done. Evidence of would indicate cause for further std concerns needed or not. Not all show immediately, why have that added worry? IMO

  104. C Morgan

    Prinnie,
    I couldn’t agree with you more on those 3!
    But Perhaps that was the plan? Since prosecution relied so heavily upon their testimony. Prove themselves not credible, while securing immunity in the process. How convenient! Make it look like the WV girls are forced to testify against their former BF. thus even if total liars (only concerned about protecting their dating pool >cesspool!). They appear more honest bc they were made to!
    And Tada! Judge is off the hook! Not guilty! Came down to the guys testimony vs. girls the case hinged upon.
    Never mind all the holes, all the unanswered questions, all the evidence potential oddly not bothered with. The 1000s of texts long ago said to not contain much, most unrelated. that was the oh crap moment of about face, we have to put on a real trial or good show… So pull as many conflicting accounts as we can! Recall too here, social media, etc. isn’t “real evidence.”
    Just a theory. Verdict prove me wrong!

    Meanwhile FranknJane went into town to celebrate. or left the country if the Feds are at all curious too?

    Where is that cd of mom’s phone data, testified early to? Was it entered evidence?

    Reply
  105. sicnangry

    I sincerely believe there is no way in HELL they could be found not guilty. My biggest concern is what the punishment will be. Is the judge going to give the “children” a slap on the wrist and say behave or will he give them what they deserve-the max-dention until they are 21. AG has announced a press conference immediately following the verdict. What do you think he is going to say?

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      At the very least I do not think any judge could say she consented to any described activity, or was in any condition to provide informed consent as described by law. What seems beyond a shadow of doubt is the damning photo evidence leading to the underage porn charge against Mays. Was there even any defense argument or testimony regarding that?

      I am a little bit worried that conviction of rape (penetration) may not be the slam-dunk it would have been if the film evidence of it had been retrieved. I sure do hope it doesn’t come down to the judge having any doubt it happened, because I think it is very obvious why the strongest evidence was deliberately destroyed, or at least not aggressively enough pursued because it was certain proof of rape.

      Reply
  106. BaronvSteuben

    Hindsight being 20/20, Mays should have tried as an adult. Those tweets were horrifying.

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      BaronvSteuben, I agree with that. No amount of effort to make him look like a choirboy, no argyle sweater or coached innocence could make those horrifying tweets go away. His betrayal of that young girl’s trust is utterly heartbreaking, and the abuse and rape by both boys went beyond criminal.

      Reply
  107. Nite_View

    We SHOULD have the answers to these questions and more later this morniing . The main question being ” Will these POS receive their just punishment , or will ‘ Judge ‘ Lipps ride home in brand new Lexus ? ‘

    Reply
    1. Nite_View

      I’d like to recind my last comment. After thinking about it , I beleive that it is far too late for these bass turds to get what they deserve. First , they should have been tried as adults … receive the max sentance in prision . . . and be required to register as sex offenders every month for life.
      As far as Reno goes .. hopefully he’ll get his too . Let him work in the fast food industry just like so many of the graduates from his ” fine ” school.
      Finally I’m sick of this BS of the defense attys saying the Lowlifes didn’t know they were doing anything wrong , because they are ‘ children ‘. My eight year old grandson is a child . . . if a sixteen year old doesn’t know what sex is it’s time for parents to have a long talk about the birdsand the bees.

      Reply
  108. Elliot N

    Very sad that in my opinion the Defense attorneys and their hired “expert” who in my opinion was intentionally a woman, seem to equate that any female who gets drunk must “deserve” what happened. It is those same “Medieval” opinions that are troublesome not just in Steubenville. By that line of reasoning does this mean that every guy who gets drunk is “asking” to be sodomized? I think the Defense was lame and I look for a swift verdict. Stupid move that will backfire in regard to the Defense mentining victims name in closing when they had been asked by Judge not to do so. AND that is the same judge that decides the verdict. My opinion is that Madison knew at that point that his client is toast and let his own emotions get in the way and he took an unprofessional shot at the victim. Not smart at all.

    Reply
  109. IknowSteubenville

    Baron
    Please realize I am NOT defending either of these creeps, but it seems to me that TM was the one most involved in this whole disaster. RM was only mentioned on a few occasions. Is it possible for the judge to sentence one to juvie and let the other off with a lighter sentence? Also, the way I read the immunity for the three is they are ONLY covered if they tell the complete truth. It seems as though, comparing the testimonies from the PC hearing and what has been reported they testified to now, there are several details/statements that don’t match up. Could this void their immunity?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      If the AG’s Office believe Cole, Craig and Westlake were being deceptive and misleading, then the the immunity protection could be withdrawn IMO.

      Reply
    2. prinnie (Post author)
      1. C Morgan

        Truly are that! What is up with the changing stories? Do these punks even know difference btw lies & truth? They are all liars!
        Who in the heck is that one kid claiming to have assaulted?!! Maybe Malik or Trent are going to fess up now to real story? Ok so not Trent!

        Reply
      2. maddgramma

        You are so right! These are sickening! Maybe this is another reason Mike DeWine is investigating this further. Who’s Farrah? Who’s Ann? So many people seeing these pictures and gee they said they were innocent! I am so glad you investigated this early on and were able to find these texts. Thank You Friend! This is going to be very interesting when all the other names come out.

        Reply
  110. Alchemist

    Both Trent and Ma’Lik have been found delinquent (guilty). Trent will serve a minimum of 2 years in custody, whereas Ma’Lik faces one year. Based on their conduct and acceptance of therapy/rehabilitation while in custody, each of them could be held in custody until they are 21 years of age. Both will have to register as sex offenders, but the frequency at which they have to report will be determined prior to their release back into the population.

    Under normal circumstances, rape/child pornography offenses result in them being a Category III offender, which means that they would have to register with the local Sheriff every 90 days. Under juvenile court rules, the judge has a little more flexibility in determining frequency of reporting, etc.

    Reply
  111. Alchemist

    Attorney-General Mike DeWine has requested that he has asked the Court to convene a Grand Jury investigation in Jefferson County, starting April 15th, to complete the investigation into any and all related crimes that may have been committed with respect to this incident.

    Mr. DeWine stated that potential charges might include: evidence tampering, failure to report, underage drinking, etc.

    Reply
  112. Alice

    Good……
    This whole case has broken my heart. How can a large population of a town’s teenagers get away with such horrid behavior for so long? This whole mess is so, so sad, for everyone.

    Thanks to Prinnie for standing up and not backing down.
    Thanks to Alchemist and C Morgan for digging deep and putting together tons of info.
    And Thanks to Harold Star for showing how the power structure of this corner of Ohio serves self first before even consitering the people to whom they are suppose to serve.

    I hope Steubenville is listening, not just hearing what they want to hear.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      I thank you Alice for listening & your loyal support (:
      Speculation is only entertained when others stand behind it, given it “louder” validity for others consideration. 🙂

      Reply
  113. Stan

    Now that Malik has been found guilty of rape AND of distributing child porn, I’m very much hoping that the other teens who shared photos/videos of JD being sexually assaulted will be prosecuted.

    I’m especially disgusted by the statements both rapists made to the court – a begrudging, barely apology! Malik fell into his lawyer’s arms, feeling soooo sorry for himself saying “my life is ruined!”. Malik ruined his own life — he also ruined JD’s but lacks the empathy to feel sorry for anybody but himself!!

    Finally, I hope that Coach Reno and the other school officials conduct will be examined and they will be charged for failing to report JD’s assault. From the text messages read into the record during the trial, it is clear Reno (and many other mandated reporters) were aware of the allegations a d did nothing. Well, besides telling star football players that if they raped anybody else they’d be suspended for 3 games
    *******

    Malik’s dad is being interviewed by a blonde CNN reporter — he is claiming that his son is innocent, there has been a cover up and accuses Evan Westlake of being the “real” culprit. Disgusting.

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      Stan, it was Mays, not Richmond found delinquent to possession of the victim’s photo’s.

      Reply
    2. John Doe #6

      Your last point raises a question for me: How far does the grant of immunity go? If it were discovered that one of the witnesses had gone beyond his role as witness/pornographer and had actually participated in the rape itself, would he be immune?

      I suspect we don’t know the answer to that question because it depends on what they said when the immunity was negotiated. But it’s hard for me to believe that any of the witnesses’ testimony was so critical to the case that the state would have been willing to grant immunity to a rape charge to get it. Possession/distribution, failure to report, underage drinking, sure. But rape?

      Reply
      1. BaronvSteuben

        If one of the witnesses went beyond watching/recording they could be charged with rape IMO.

        Reply
        1. Stan

          As a number of commenters have noted, immunity is conditional upon telling the truth – and it sure sounds like a number of the witnesses changed their stories bw giving formal statements and the trial.

          Also, making AND distributing child porn is a criminal offense. For the kids who “just” took pictures/videos OR forwarded them to their friends broke the law and this COULD be charged.

          Reply
  114. Timmeh

    DeWine’s political ambitions and national profile ensure that what happened will be properly investigated. Lots of people are watching. Based on his statements, if anyone did something they should not have, then they should be very nervous. He seems to think there is something here more than the two already found delinquent.

    Kick the stones and watch the cockroaches run.

    Reply
  115. Rose7

    Prinnie … Anonymous … KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK! We need you!

    Reply
    1. maddgramma

      Thank You Prinnie and Anonymous and all who have brought out so much evidence to get a conviction in this trial. I hope you keep digging and get plenty more for The Attorney General Mike DeWine. I truly believe he meant what he said “if there was any Tampering with Evidence” I think my opinion only, he will find alot of it!!! Again, Thank You Friend

      Reply
  116. C Morgan

    This was a great thing to hear on TV as I was waking up! Although there is no equivalent “real” justice that could equal the hurt it caused JD, it is a vindication in her strongly taking a stand. Stand tall bc justice stood behind you. Time does heal. Promise <3
    AG surprised me. So glad to hear they aren't done! Had to wonder if he had 2 versions of speeches?! /:
    He can just see Prinnie on how that needs to proceed! And the rest of you too (: on very valid questions that still linger!
    I'm going to park my a$$ on the beach in the surf, to celebrate for JD now… And try to suppress the spinning wheels! Ok so only for a few hours! (;

    Reply
  117. Mike

    “Now it is highly likely that a civil case will be brought against the defendants and though Mr Fitzsimmons would not be drawn on the timing of any such action he has confirmed that he is representing the family in the matter, adding: ‘Remorse did come late in my opinion.’”

    That made me smile.

    Reply
  118. irishgirl999

    Well done, Prinnie. Hopefully JD can begin to move on with her life now.

    Reply
  119. irishgirl999

    I just want to add that I don’t believe for a minute that the full extent of that horrifying night has been revealed.

    Reply
    1. Pete Basil

      I agree with you irishgirl999!! I don’t think it has all been revealed either. Hopefully, the grand jury will bring out the rest of the truth and many others will be held accountable for their actions. It’ll be then, the people of this town will see they can not “lie to the grave” or cover up for friends and conspire to make “it” go away…that is not how were were brought up and taught and that is not what we should be teaching the youth of this city!

      Reply
  120. fransmama

    Can anybody out there put out the site where we can send our continued encouragement and praise to her and her family for enduring this ordeal? it was out there once but I’ve lost track of so many of these sites you click onto. I believe the comments are fitered through their atty Fiztimmons.
    Like most, so pleased that two are facing consequences for that fateful night, hope the rest also are (not) looking forward to more subpeonas.
    SHAME, on those to chicken sh.. to tell the truth about what really happened. Generations w/ no conscious. Scarey, parents, kids, officials of all sorts. They are the dark empty voices of the Valley. For those of you from elsewhere, please know, not all who live here are so lacking in decency. WE too are legion, WE FORGIVE (unlike anons) but WE DO NOT FORGET.
    Again, if anyone knows the websight where I may be so honored to thank JD and her family for their courage throughout this nightmare, could you post it? Thank you

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)
  121. thinkin man

    I too was surprised at Dewine’s announcement. Who will run the grand jury? Hopefully not Jane Hanlin and her associates. All the good news of the day would not have been possible had Steubenville/Jeff Co. been left to decide matters on their own. The more outside scrutiny the better!

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      AG’s Office will run the Grand Jury proceedings.

      Reply
      1. thinkin man

        Thanks, Baron, that’s great news!

        It’s SPRING CLEANING TIME in Steubenville!

        Want to add my note of thanks to Prinnie & all the others here & elsewhere who brought this case to, and kept it in, the national news. Despte what Mr. Bruzzese says, the public pressure had a positive effect.

        Sleep & dream well, Jane Doe. You did good. Heroines don’t need to be perfect. They just need to stand tall like you did.

        If people don’t learn from this terrible ordeal, it’s their loss.

        Reply
        1. prinnie (Post author)

          Frank Bruzzese is my biggest fan. Okay, so I’m being facetious but I did giggle when he blocked me on FB.

          Reply
  122. sicnangry

    Did I hear the judge say that defendants are responsible for court costs? Didn’t seem like the families were to prepared to make statements for leniency. I think they were too confident and it came back to bite!! I’ve read alot of people were angry about the sentence. I honestly was surprised. I thought for sure it would be time served, goodbye. I know juvenile detention centers aren’t prison, but my brother has to go in them to do electrical inspections and he says they are really bad! He says the inmates run the asylum. There have been threats on twitter to JD and the sheriff’s office is asking anyone who sees them to report them. Don’t these idiots and thugs get it!! Did you notice how fast AG said Yes to reporter about investigating April rape. He didn’t even let reporter finish question. This is Not over. I bet there will be alot of teens out sick tomorrow at SHS. Nodianos is probably shitting. Did you hear MR father tell cnn Westlake raped her, not his son? Pfinnie you must be so proud!! We all are so thankful for all your hard work and all the shit you’ve put up with to continue this fight!! My thoughts and prayers are with JD and family tonight.

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      Mays and Richmond aren’t going to a juvenile detention center; they will be incarcerated at a DYS facility-juvenile prison. There’s a juvenile detention located at the Jefferson County Justice Center. Mays and Richmond were held there until released by Judge Lipps after the amenability hearing in November.

      Reply
  123. sicnangry

    Sorry–PRINNIE!! Forgot to proof!

    Reply
  124. ResoL411

    Baron…your last name isn’t Bruzzese is it?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      No.

      Reply
      1. BooBoo

        Baron I think that is the first time a reply and an avatar actually went good together and made me laugh LOL I can actually see you replying to Resol’s question saying No grrrrr with your teeth clenched LOL

        Reply
  125. Alchemist

    @ResoL411 March 17, 2013 at 11:20 pm

    Baron…your last name isn’t Bruzzese is it?

    The Baron is not a lawyer (although he thinks like one); furthermore, he has advocated for Trent Mays to be tried as an adult. Show me where Frank Bruzzese has made similar arguments?

    Frankly, you owe the Baron an apology for comparing him to the likes of Bruzzese.

    Reply
  126. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

    I am still confused about the issue of Jane Doe’s test for drugging. The court testimony has brought out conflicting info on that. One version was that she tested negative for date-rape drugs, then another version had a doctor telling her it was too late for drug test. Another version I’ve read in a newspaper said J.D did not wish to be tested. Can anyone please clear that up?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      The AG’s Office didn’t present a tox screen report at trial. There was trial testimony Jane Die did have a tox screen done and it came back positive. I believe one of her friends related that info. You would think the AG’s Office would have gotten the results it if was done since it would have made the impairment issue that much easier to establish at trial. In the end eyewitnesses proved she had zero ability to consent.

      Reply
  127. Alchemist

    @Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle) March 18, 2013 at 12:04 am

    I am still confused about the issue of Jane Doe’s test for drugging. The court testimony has brought out conflicting info on that. One version was that she tested negative for date-rape drugs, then another version had a doctor telling her it was too late for drug test. Another version I’ve read in a newspaper said J.D did not wish to be tested. Can anyone please clear that up?

    My understanding is that Jane Doe refused a rape kit; it was also said that the physicians at the local hospital advised that too much time had elapsed in the interim, and that a rape kit would not reveal evidence of value. I am unaware of what tox screens may have been carried out at the hospital, or what such tests may have revealed, if they were, in fact, carried out. The fact of the matter is that most date-rape drugs are eliminated from the body relatively quickly — thus it is important to be tested ASAP if one suspects such substances were ingested. Due to the time elapsed, such tests as may have been carried out at the hospital may not have revealed the presence of date-rape drugs.

    That said, there are tests (e.g. hair follicles) that will reveal whether certain date-rape drugs have been administered. I am led to believe that traces of these can be found even as late as a month after the fact. Why these tests were not carried out is unclear.

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      Thank you, Alchemist. Your info helps clarify the confusing drug testing issue, which was driving me crazy!

      Reply
    2. C Morgan

      I listened to the testimony on. The test they used for what was needed for tracing benza… (Valium, Xanax, etc) was NOT the correct levels that are used to detect rohypnol and similar. So it would be more correct to say the toxicology report was inconclusive, not negative. bc the lab, or the ordering dr/nurse fudged up!! Unbelievable.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        She also confirmed the hair follicle test would have. 4 weeks is the optimum time for. And no she was never tested for!

        Reply
      2. C Morgan

        *benzodiazpines is the drug class. She tested negative for the lab used for Xanax etc./anxiety meds Only.

        Reply
        1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

          C Morgan, Thanks for this further clarification. There are so many different possible drugs and combos of drugs which can make someone incoherent when mixed with alcohol. It (drug tests, offerings) does not seem to have been handled very professionally. I guess we’ll never know about any drugs, if they were slipped into her drink.

          Reply
  128. C Morgan

    Has Dr. Pill… Oops Phil issued a public apology yet?? He did in so many words, condone a rape on national TV. For being duped into thinking tent city existed?? That he was supporting team “truth oppressors” with one of their many shams to deflect?? That the only 2 people present, Prinnie & the attorney in audience had the only credible insight to contribute, yet were silenced?? And especially to Jane Doe for belittling her tragedy??! Just wondering.

    I still want to know where the hell is the CD the cop testified to, of original evidence from the phone when the crime was reported?? Did it disappear?? I don’t recall it entered as evidence at PC hearing or trial. Did I miss something?

    Reply
  129. ResoL411

    Alchemist March 17, 2013 at 11:30 pm · Reply @ResoL411 March 17, 2013 at 11:20 pm Baron…your last name isn’t Bruzzese is it? The Baron is not a lawyer (although he thinks like one); furthermore, he has advocated for Trent Mays to be tried as an adult. Show me where Frank Bruzzese has made similar arguments? Frankly, you owe the Baron an apology for comparing him to the likes of Bruzzese.

    I’m just alluding to his copious amounts of spot-on details surrounding everyone in this case. Funny thought though…I never said anything about him being Frank Bruzzese?

    Hmmmmmmm?

    Reply
  130. ballard

    Deeply thankful there is a guilty result. Congratulations for everyone, especially Prinnie, that worked so hard here to bring a spotlight to the Steubenville rape of Jane Doe. Its so much larger than this weird little small town or this trial. I must admit, sadly that it has also distracted and helped me in my normal work!

    The things people talk about on social media and mainstream media around this case, connected or complicit in Steubenville or not, are extremely troublesome. But this has changed things. This result just highlights how far people have come about women’s rights, sexual assault, rape awareness and how much more there must be to come. Thank you commentators for trying to make visible these distinctions.

    But, most importantly, thanks to brave Jane Doe. She should not be perfect, those that are truly important are also like ourselves, she teaches others that the things are not what others tell them are real, they speak out so they can change the world (yes, it seems that big)… even it is moment by moment. X

    I worry about how much this town will revolt from further charges…but, one small step at for Steubenville…

    Reply
  131. Alchemist

    In the various and sundry electronic communications that were unearthed by the BCI, as testified to at the recently-concluded rape trial by forensic examiner JoAnn Gibb, amongst other things, the following exchanges were reported to have been found in evidence:

    Cody Saltsman (To Trent Mays): I wanna see the vid of u hitting her with your weiner.

    Trent Mays: I don’t know who took it lol.

    So, here it would appear that Cody Saltsman is requesting that Trent Mays send him a video (or link to a copy thereof) wherein Trent can be seen hitting an underage girl with his penis. (In other words, engaged in the act of masturbation.)

    Now, I could see Saltsman attempting to argue that his comments were intended as a joke, but Trent’s reply seems to indicate that Trent interpreted it as a request to provide a copy of said video (or a link thereto) the nature of which clearly and unambiguously falls squarely in the ambit of Federal and/or State criminal statutes covering child pornography.

    It is entirely likely that Trent would have provided a copy (or link thereto) to Saltsman, if he possessed such, or otherwise knew where it could be obtained.

    Let’s not forget the context here: the victim was naked, unconscious, and in the process of being raped/sexually abused and recorded, while Trent was ejaculating and splattering the victim with his semen (as could be seen in photos recovered, and entered into evidence.
    Accordingly, it is inescapable that:

    1) Saltsman knew that the victim was a minor, and

    2) That he also knew the sexual nature of the performance, given his description.

    I think a reasonably good case could be made for Saltsman’s solicitation (or attempted solicitation) of child pornography, or pandering, given the brief outlines of the law shown below.

    The main Federal child pornography statute on the books is: USC Title 18 Part I Chapter 110 › § 2252A. This statute has survived appeals on Constitutional grounds to the U.S. Supreme Court. In the case of U.S. v Williams, the court held:

    Held:

    1. Section 2252A(a)(3)(B) is not overbroad under the First Amendment. Pp. 6–18.

    (a) A statute is facially invalid if it prohibits a substantial amount of protected speech. Section 2252A(a)(3)(B) generally prohibits offers to provide and requests to obtain child pornography. It targets not the underlying material, but the collateral speech introducing such material into the child-pornography distribution network.

    Its definition of material or purported material that may not be pandered or solicited precisely tracks the material held constitutionally proscribable in New York v. Ferber, 458 U. S. 747, and Miller v. California, 413 U. S. 15: obscene material depicting (actual or virtual)
    children engaged in sexually explicit conduct, and any other material depicting actual children engaged in sexually explicit conduct. The statute’s important features include:

    (1) a scienter requirement; (2) operative verbs that are reasonably read to penalize speech that accompanies or seeks to induce a child pornography transfer from one person to another;

    […]

    Source: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/07pdf/06-694.pdf

    The operative sections of 18USC2252A are as follows:

    USC › Title 18 › Part I › Chapter 110 › § 2252A

    18 USC § 2252A – Certain activities relating to material constituting or containing child pornography

    (a) Any person who—

    3) knowingly—

    (A) reproduces any child pornography for distribution through the mails, or using any means or facility of interstate or foreign commerce or in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer; or

    (B) advertises, promotes, presents, distributes, or solicits through the mails, or using any means or facility of interstate or foreign commerce or in or affecting interstate or foreign commerce by any means, including by computer, any material or purported material in a manner that reflects the belief, or that is intended to cause another to believe, that the material or purported material is, or contains—

    (i) an obscene visual depiction of a minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct; or

    (ii) a visual depiction of an actual minor engaging in sexually explicit conduct;

    […]

    Source: http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2252A?quicktabs_8=1#quicktabs-8

    Solicitation is also prohibited by Ohio Law, to wit:

    Ohio Revised Code
    » Title [29] XXIX CRIMES – PROCEDURE
    » Chapter 2907: SEX OFFENSES

    2907.322 Pandering sexually oriented matter involving a minor.

    (A) No person, with knowledge of the character of the material or performance involved, shall do any of the following:

    (1) Create, record, photograph, film, develop, reproduce, or publish any material that shows a minor participating or engaging in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality;

    (2) Advertise for sale or dissemination, sell, distribute, transport, disseminate, exhibit, or display any material that shows a minor participating or engaging in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality;

    (3) Create, direct, or produce a performance that shows a minor participating or engaging in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality;

    (4) Advertise for presentation, present, or participate in presenting a performance that shows a minor participating or engaging in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality;

    (5) Knowingly solicit, receive, purchase, exchange, possess, or control any material that shows a minor participating or engaging in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality;

    (6) Bring or cause to be brought into this state any material that shows a minor participating or engaging in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality, or bring, cause to be brought, or finance the bringing of any minor into or across this state with the intent that the minor engage in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality in a performance or for the purpose of producing material containing a visual representation depicting the minor engaged in sexual activity, masturbation, or bestiality.

    (B)

    (1) This section does not apply to any material or performance that is sold, disseminated, displayed, possessed, controlled, brought or caused to be brought into this state, or presented for a bona fide medical, scientific, educational, religious, governmental, judicial, or other proper purpose, by or to a physician, psychologist, sociologist, scientist, teacher, person pursuing bona fide studies or research, librarian, clergyman, prosecutor, judge, or other person having a proper interest in the material or performance.

    (2) Mistake of age is not a defense to a charge under this section.

    (3) In a prosecution under this section, the trier of fact may infer that a person in the material or performance involved is a minor if the material or performance, through its title, text, visual representation, or otherwise, represents or depicts the person as a minor.

    (C) Whoever violates this section is guilty of pandering sexually oriented matter involving a minor. Violation of division (A)(1), (2), (3), (4), or (6) of this section is a felony of the second degree. Violation of division (A)(5) of this section is a felony of the fourth degree. If the offender previously has been convicted of or pleaded guilty to a violation of this section or section 2907.321 or 2907.323 of the Revised Code, pandering sexually oriented matter involving a minor in violation of division (A)(5) of this section is a felony of the third degree.

    Source: http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/2907.322

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      It will be interesting to see if either Mays or Richmond cooperates with law enforcement now that their trials are over.

      Reply
  132. iLivein thevalley

    Thanks Prinnie, without you this would never have come to light.

    Reply
  133. Alchemist

    @BaronvSteuben March 18, 2013 at 10:08 am

    It will be interesting to see if either Mays or Richmond cooperates with law enforcement now that their trials are over.

    They are not going to have a choice — if they refuse to cooperate, it can be held against them; the authorities will interpret any such failure to cooperate as evidence of non-rehabilitation, which will extend their sentences past the judge-imposed minimums. Furthermore, any failure to cooperate will be taken into account prior to release, when the judge will make a decision with respect to reporting requirements with respect to sex-offender registration. If they don’t cooperate, they can have the Tier III rules imposed: reporting in with the Sheriff every 90 days for life.

    BTW, what did you think of my legal analysis of Saltsman’s potential liability for pandering? Do you think I interpreted the law correctly?

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      I think your analysis of Revised Code Section 2907.322(A)(5) is spot on. The proof will be in the evidentiary pudding; can law enforcement establish proof of who sent the tweet and who responded?

      The next question is more of a practical one; will law enforcement want to prosecute everyone who may have asked for a picture but didn’t actually receive one. How far do they wish to go in potential future prosecutions? This goes to potential failure to report charges against others who didn’t actually see the rape in real time like Cole, Craig and Westlake, but may have received knowledge via tweets that something criminal, possibly a rape, had occurred. How far do they wish to expand the investigation?

      Reply
  134. Toni Dear

    One local station, WTRF is reporting on their homepage that the sheriff is investigating a death threat against JD shortly after the verdict was read. It was posted via a tweet on the internet…didn’t anybody learn anything at all? The other local station, WTOV, will be reporting at 5:30 the highlights of a 30-minute interview that he had with the recused county
    prosecutor regarding the fact that she and her family had to leave their home during the trial due to death threats. She is also asked whether she and her son were 2 of the 16 that did not cooperate with the state regarding her and her son’s involvement/non-involvement in THIS incident. It was also announced thatr the city manager is behind a grand jury request even if it has been implicated that coaches may be called….she said that people’s lives are more important than football….

    Reply
  135. Elliot N

    Hi Pete! Stay tuned as I feel more will be revealed.

    Reply
  136. IknowSteubenville

    Just a question regarding the Grand Jury – I realize the AG’s office is going to present the cases but where will the jury pool come from? If the jury members come from Steubenville/Jefferson County I worry about the jury pool being contaminated due to fear of repercussions from the local powers-that-be.

    Reply
    1. BaronvSteuben

      Grand Jurors will come from citizens of Jefferson County. If AG wishes to indict someone for an alleged criminal act; need 7/9 Grand Jurors to indict.

      Reply
      1. IknowSteubenville

        Thank you.

        Reply
  137. Alchemist

    TwitLonger
    DarkProtest (@CJInstructorTN)
    Posted Monday 18th March 2013 from Twitlonger

    VERY IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT REGARDING JANE DOE. #Steubenville #JaneDoe

    Please be advised that YOU play an important role in helping JaneDoe sue for defamation all of those who call her things like slut, whore, tramp, etc. Courts have long recognized that this is defamation (specifically libel) and the mere calling of these names proves defamation on its face. There is NO NEED for Jane Doe to have the burden of proof. Even those who did NOT call names, per se, but who taunted with words like “she deserved it,” may be subject to liability for “intentional infliction of emotional distress.”

    You can screen shot these foul tweets and the people that tweet them and get them to Jane Doe’s legal team. These children must learn a lesson right now…that this type of bullying is unacceptable. Their parents will make sure they learn it when they are faced with lawsuits because of their children.

    Please send the screenshots to: socialmediaaccounts@outlook.com – No replies will be sent back.

    OR CONTACT @MISSPELL FOR OTHER DIRECTIONS. I was not able to reach her before getting this tweet out; hence, the email address provided. IF I am emailed, I will make sure they get to proper people.

    Threats and verbal assaults will be met swiftly with prosecution from MY end. My lawyers are free, and you should know I taught Criminal Justice as a profession. Trolls beware.

    http://www.twitlonger.com/show/lb8t7c

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Good news! I have quite a few in the old files…

      Reply
  138. C Morgan

    Harold Star’s “Hanlin Forecast”… Lol. Tell it like it is Harold! (:
    See comments:
    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/what-about-jane-hanlin-steubenville/

    Reply
  139. C Morgan

    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/now-for-questions-about-frank-bruzzese-and-stranahan/

    Oh yes Frank did just tweet: the Prinnie lynch mob blog was all wrong! Lol to Stranahan no less!

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Stay classy, Frank.

      Reply
  140. budman70

    The mob wasn’t to far off and besides it’s not over yet!! 🙂

    Reply
    1. ResoL411

      Agreed. Budman70, the “mob” wasn’t far off at all. Did you guys see her interview? Ole Jane reminds me of the mother on “The Sopranos”. http://www.wtov9.com/news/news/web-extra-news9s-unedited-interview-jefferson-co-p/nWwpR/

      Reply
  141. QC

    Thanks Prinnie for fighting the good fight for justice to be served.

    Are you aware of this? (Links to articles below excerpts)

    “Federal Agents are investigating another allegation of sexual assault of a FOURTEEN year old girl at a Prom party at which several members of Steubenville’s Big Red football team were present, it can be revealed today.

    MailOnline has learned that a report was filed with Steubenville City Police in September and relates to an incident that allegedly took place at a house party in the small Ohio town last April.”

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2260990/EXCLUSIVE-Second-girl-sexually-assaulted-prom-party-attended-Ohio-high-school-footballers–just-FOURTEEN.html#ixzz2NwUx7A24

    Also this:

    “Undated photographs were stored on cellphone belonging to friend of the Steubenville case accused Ma’lik Richmond and Trent Mays
    Raises chilling possibility of TWO MORE, as yet unknown, victims
    They show two girls, both face down and in a state of undress on distinctive carpet – strikingly similar to image taken in August of alleged victim
    In that photo her arms are tucked underneath her as she was silent, motionless and unconscious as the accused carried out sexual acts on her”

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2260542/EXCLUSIVE-Pictures-cellphone-TWO-MORE-girls-semi-naked-face-basement-16-year-old-raped-Ohio-football-stars.html#ixzz2NwViS35Y

    Reply
  142. C Morgan

    http://m.wtov9.com/news/news/breaking-news-2-arrested-connection-threats-jane-d/nWwmd/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=facebook
    Time to make an example before it gets out of hand! Well done. Now please the follow through…

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Now see guys, that wasn’t so hard was it? Had you acted as quickly when the guys were broadcasting of raping a girl online, and posting lewd photos… We would not be where we are now. Live & learn? Or bc the world is watching? I hope it’s the first one.

      Reply
  143. Alchemist

    What about Jane Hanlin? #Steubenville
    March 18, 2013 | by Radio | Blog | 9 Comments
    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/what-about-jane-hanlin-steubenville/

    All kinds of rumors and accusations have swirled on social media about Jane Hanlin. Hanlin is the prosecutor of Jefferson County, Ohio.

    Things have been said about Jane Hanlin that is said about few “white women” and that’s a fact. It goes with the high profile territory of a county prosecutor where an infamous case is taking place. I’m sure she has taken it in stride.

    One thing missing from the Jane Hanlin accusations is they have never appeared in main stream media. They likely won’t – because they do not exist as fact is my best guess.

    Jane Doe absolved her son of any involvement in the rape case. That needs to be mentioned. She said he wasn’t there.

    I’m assuming there has been no wrong doing on her part. I’m assuming the AG DeWine was truthful when he said no cover-up in Steubenville. I’m assuming.

    Spare no boogie man in the closet – it looks to me like Jane Hanlin sees clear blue skies and fantastic weather ahead!

    HAROLD STAR
    Monday, March 18, 2013 at 4:25 am

    I don’t know about “clear blue skies and fantastic weather ahead” for Jane Hanlin. Always, after a hurricane dissipates there is a period of blue skies and fantastic weather, until the next bad weather system develops.

    After a bad hurricane (Category 5 in this case), the experts try to figure out the dynamics of its initial developments. Whether their models were correct and whether their projections were accurate.

    The “tropical depression” in which Steubenville’s hurricane developed into such a major storm started approximately seven years ago or so. Tropical Depression Jane began when Jane Hanlin merged with other low pressure systems –the Bruzzese and Calabria weather systems.

    Jane became a law partner with Bruzzese and Calabria. She also became an assistant county prosecutor with them and other Bruzzese Law Firm members under former county prosecutor and law partner Thomas Straus.

    Jane was a member of the Steubenville City School Board at the time. She even served as the president of the school board. Her law partner’s wife was on the school board with her. Her other law partner’s brother-in-law was on the school board with her. Ohio Law States AND the Ohio Attorney General (now DeWine) through a formal and published opinion specifically enunciate that a county prosecutor (or assistant county prosecutors) is prohibited from serving on the school board. Current and former law partners Hanlin, Bruzzese, Calabria, Agresta and Straus ignored the “storms” development from its inception.

    Jane became immersed in the activities and support of Steubenville High School, its athletes, its coaches, administrators and personnel. So much so that she even tainted the integrity of her office as prosecutor to lend the position of prosecutor as a character witness in West Virginia to a former Steubenville High School athlete convicted of armed robbery.

    Had Jane Hanlin and her law partners followed the law from the outset, not become (as school board member Agresta now says) a “buddy” of the students, maybe when news of an alleged crime occured involving Steubenville athletes, her insight, integrity and common sense would not have been compromised. It wouldn’t have taken her ten days to decide she had a conflict of interest. She wouldn’t have controlled the flow of the case because she would have left it up to an “independent” prosecutor to file the charges. Instead she filed the charges, filed motions to try the students as adults and then dumped the matter in the Attorney General’s lap.

    There was no “rush” to immediately charge the students. They weren’t going anywhere. The Attorney General’s Office was asked to be involved by the Steubenville Police from the beginning. Jane Hanlin was not needed. The Attorney General’s Office, with their prosecutors (had charges not been rushed into)could have taken the matter slowly and meticuously. They could have done then (August 2012) what they are going to have to do now (April 2013). Impanel a Grand Jury and try to reconstruct how this simple “tropical storm” developed into a “tropical depresson” and then merged into other foul weather systems to become such a major hurricane.

    Attorney General DeWine, no matter how much he want’s to clear Jane Hanlin of any involvement or wrong doing, simply cannot in light of the fact that she violated the law and his opinon on the law regarding being a prosecutor and a school board member at the same time. It turns out, this was not a minor infraction. It was not just a few “sprinkles”. It was, in reality, one of the major contributing factors which caused the “storm” to get out of control in the first place.

    We don’t know yet, but when the football coach, according to one convicted student rapist’s text messages” stated that Reno would “take care of everything” whether or not that “taking care of everything” included contact with Jane Hanlin. There is no other way the coach could have “taken care of everything.”

    Now, there are two new witnesses that may cause the entire “house of cards” to come tumbling down–the two convicted rapists. They did not testify in court. Now, they have everything to gain by cooperating with Attorney General investigators and prosecutors by telling them what, if any, contact, conversations, instructions or directions they received from anyone in the Steubenville school system. Their appeal, if any, will never be successful so they can help themselves while in youth detention by fessing up now.

    Those two are now the two key witnesses to the school systems involvement and/or coverup. Now it is to their advantage to throw whomever is necessary, under the bus.

    And so, it really does not appear that “clear blue skies and fantastic weather” is ahead. The victim and her family will eventaully get the last word, perhaps from the school system and public officals. The Tsunami may be over—but we are just now beginning the Suemommy season.

    Reply
    1. John Doe #6

      Blue skies? April will be here before you know it.

      Reply
  144. ResoL411
    1. John Doe #6

      You know what struck me as odd about that? There isn’t a single mention of Richmond, anywhere. You’d think just once his name would come up in all the who-did-what Q&A in the texts, but it’s as if he’s invisible.

      I’ve never been able to get a grasp on his relationship with the rest of the kids. Who invited him, what’s he doing there? I don’t get the impression anyone there thought of him as a friend or anything, yet somehow out of all these kids he’s the one that winds up being at Cole’s house at the critical moment. In all the mountains of tweets and texts, except for once in the Nodi video, there never seems to be any reference to him at all.

      Does this seem weird to anyone else?

      Reply
  145. C Morgan

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2295419/Reno-Saccoccia-charges-Steubenville-football-coach-face-charges-failing-report-rape-told-star-players-hed-make-away.html
    I forgot he testified as a character witness for at their original hearing. How proud he was of, & good boys!? When he allegedly knew all about the rape at that point!! Sick man! I’d say he followed through on claims right there, to start…
    And JH is now discounting Trent’s texts in regards to the coach, bc he is a known liar. Really, why is that only now true??

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Uh oh! Going after the homes of the parties, now being questioned.
      Including Nodi video location.
      Hey Prinnie, frank maybe should have stayed quiet a little longer?! :b seems much of what was alleged is materializing as valid.

      http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2295565/Owners-Steubenville-house-teen-raped-prosecuted-drunken-throwing-party.html

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        Just see the Nodi video… There’s a case of beer in screenshot at least once in the room.

        Reply
  146. ResoL411

    And honestly I’m getting really tired (and miffed) of hearing DeWine continually saying “We might…, we could…, we may have to, just in case, we’re considering charges” ARE YOU KIDDING ME?… with regards to EVERYONE ELSE around this poor girls case. Steubenville’s lot needs a big ole legal slap back to normalcy, respectability and accountability.

    Reply
  147. C Morgan

    And so the AG is having to clean up behind a certain PA, who failed miserably at doing the job. But why??
    While I don’t condone threats on anyone, are we supposed to sympathize with her? like she did with JD? who had suffered far worse than, in addition to threats of bad intent upon… and still being targeted!
    Here comes round 1 of the deflection game.

    And for those who missed… The 15y old who threatened JD also, was detailed on radionewz. Including comments on daughter’s behalf earlier today.
    Why is the name J****e ringing a distant bell??
    She claims to be a supporter of JD all along. But daughter & co are friends of convicted, and failed to listen to reason. The girl made some derogatory comments, including celebrating by beating the crap Out of (toned down). Mom was punishing, but clearly didn’t fit the severity of the crime.

    Reply
  148. Alchemist

    Now the (New York) papers are flat-out coming out and suggesting that Coach Reno knew about the rapes and tried to shield his players. We also see the spectre of Jane Hanlin in a WTOV9 interview dismissing the comments about “Reno will take care of it” by stating that these were made by a proven liar (i.e. Trent Mays). Good thing that the Grand Jury will be run by the AG’s office, not Jane Hanlin.

    New York Daily News article follows:

    Steubenville football coach knew athletes raped girl, 16, and still tried to shield them of prosecution: court evidence
    Meanwhile, two teenage girls were arrested for threatening the rape victim on Twitter, according to reports.
    By Christian Red AND Michael O’keeffe / NEW YORK DAILY NEWS
    Published: Monday, March 18, 2013, 7:44 PM
    Updated: Monday, March 18, 2013, 10:08 PM

    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/steubenville-coach-shield-prosecution-article-1.1292299#ixzz2NwgJQBiM

    [photo]
    Steubenville Football Coach Reno Saccoccia in 2005. Saccoccia not only knew that two of his players had sexually assaulted a teen-age girl during a booze-fueled night last August, he also tried to shield his athletes from prosecution, evidence presented during last week’s trial suggests.

    Steubenville High School football coach Reno Saccoccia not only knew that two of his players had sexually assaulted a teen-age girl during a booze-fueled night last August, he also tried to shield his athletes from prosecution, evidence presented during last week’s trial of the two players suggests.

    Saccoccia, who has won three state championships and has been inducted into the Ohio Coaches Hall of Fame, is just one of the Steubenville coaches, parents and students who could face criminal charges after a grand jury reviews evidence from the case next month.

    Ohio Attorney General Mike DeWine announced on Sunday that he would convene a grand jury on April 15 to determine if criminal charges should be filed against coaches, parents and football players who failed to report shared photos of the assault on social media, failed to report the incident or attempted to cover it up.

    “You cannot bring finality to this without the convening of a grand jury,” DeWine said on Sunday, shortly after a judge pronounced “Big Red” quarterback Trent Mays, 17, and receiver Ma’Lik Richmond guilty in the horrific rape of a girl from a nearby West Virginia community. “We have 16 witnesses who would not talk to us.”

    [photo]
    Ma’lik Richmond in tears after verdict.

    According to a CNN report, two girls who posted threatening tweets aimed at the female victim, were arrested Monday by sheriff’s deputies and state investigators. The report said that Jefferson County Sheriff Fred Abdalla confirmed that the girls, 15 and 16, are from Steubenville and were placed in a juvenile jail facility, awaiting an appearance before a judge on Tuesday.

    Cathy Davison, the Steubenville city manager, said the city supports the grand jury investigation because it’s important that justice is served.

    RELATED: STEUBENVILLE HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL PLAYERS FOUND GUILTY IN RAPE OF 16-YEAR-OLD: JUDGE
    http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/steubenville-high-school-football-players-found-guilty-rape-16-year-old-judge-article-1.1291087

    [photo]
    Trent Mays (l.) was also in tears after the verdict.

    Advocates for sexual-assault victims also applauded DeWine’s decision to have a grand jury review the case, but they said the Steubenville case demonstrates that aggressive law enforcement needs to be coupled with strong prevention programs.

    “This was a tragic situation for everybody involved, and it shows that coaches and parents need to reinforce the message that sexual violence will not be tolerated,” said Katie Hanna, executive director of the Ohio Alliance to End Sexual Violence.

    Teammates testified that they saw Mays and Richmond penetrate the 16-year-old victim with their hands, which constitutes rape under Ohio law. Some photographed and videotaped the football stars as they degraded the intoxicated girl; others joked about the incident on social media. None of them went to the police that night.

    “There’s ample reason to believe there were other bystanders who could have intervened and didn’t,” said Duke associate vice-provost Donna Lisker, who teaches a gender and sports seminar at the university.

    [photo: showing victim carried by ankles and wrists]
    A terrifying photo linked to the sexual assault case.

    Steubenville, a recent survey indicates, is not an anomaly: More than half the teens and young adults polled last week for the Avon Foundation for Women said they would find it difficult to intervene in a sexual assault or dating violence. Forty percent said they would not even know what to do if they witnessed such a crime.

    Ohio’s Jefferson County, which includes Steubenville, receives $15,000 from the federal government annually to hire a parttime rape-crisis advocate, according to Hanna. That person’s responsibilities include assisting and counseling victims as they are being examined at local hospitals and directing them to available resources. There is no funding, she added, for programs that teach athletes and other students to intervene. That is why it is critical for coaches and other adults to teach students that sexual violence will not be tolerated.

    “I do think about how heroic these young people could have been, had more of those people in that room intervened, and said, ‘This is not OK, you need to stop this. She’s vulnerable and helpless at this point. We need to get her out of here,’” Lisker said. “Those are opportunities for heroism that were missed. I know that at Duke, we’re really focusing on what we call ‘bystander intervention’ — and we have a program for that.
    That is something we really want to teach.”

    [photo]
    Defense attorney Walter Madison comforts Ma’lik Richmond after judge rules that the 16-year-old and Trent Mays, 17, were guilty in the rape of a 16-year-old girl.

    The case spotlighted the impact that social media can play in criminal investigations, and how it continues to be a factor in the fallout of the guilty verdicts of the two boys.

    Text messages and other evidence presented in last week’s trial suggested that Trent Mays in particular believed his status as a football star — and the privilege “Big Red” football enjoys in Steubenville — protected him from prosecution.

    “I think we often invest heroism in the wrong people,” Lisker said. “It can be dangerous to say that a 16-year-old or 17-year-old should be a role model because he or she can do impressive things on the field athletically. I think as a country, time and again, we’ve made that mistake with athletes.

    “It’s hard for a kid getting that to keep his or her values and priorities straight. You start to believe your own press after a while,” she added.

    Saccoccia may have also come to believe that his football success shielded his players from accountability, but rape-victim advocates say the coach failed his athletes in a big way.

    “That’s where you need really strong adult leadership, from coaches, from parents, from others to help that kid put it all in perspective,” Lisker said. “Not easy to come by.”

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Yet, there are some who continue to hold onto their “false narrative”. This story is FAR from over. When football becomes more important than common decency, you can bet your arse that the public will have a say about it.

      Reply
      1. ballard

        -About that false narrative, am I the only one in thinking after reading Carpenters short transcript of the 3000 texts read on court, how much Localleaks were conservative in details? Who is this person Brandon, or Zach? Ironic that people, worried about their town/self worth/status talk about false narratives when the amount of information from trial was actually a little worse than many were speculating.

        Also, this is an international problem, the problem of educating nonfelons. Yet tweets from teens are still after arrests still arrogant, boring, unintelligent, inflammatory. No social media focus yet Steubenville parents…sigh

        Reply
  149. maddadof2grls

    From what I saw the kids text messages were a very big part of what ended up convicting two boys of rape. Why now one day later is JH trying to discredit text messages that the court held in such high regard?

    Reply
  150. VapeBHO

    wow, busy place.

    Reply
  151. Mark

    When I first learned of this incident and Prinie’s efforts to shine a light on it, it evoked a visceral response. I’ve seen the same pattern of community denial and enablement surrounding the “sacred” athletes whose behavior should land them in the legal system. I did not want to comment until the trial concluded. My worst fear was that the judge would let the players slide.

    And so for the two players, football is now a foregone conclusion. And for some people, this is a travesty.

    The recent threats to JD and the reactions to the incriminating text messages indicate the deep denial and dysfunction in Steubenville.

    The most interesting part of the text messages involves Coach Reno’s actions to cover up the crime. It’s evident that he knew and had been in contact with the players. In order for the cover up to work, it takes two to tango, so to speak.

    And so I awake today with the burning question of the day: With whom did Coach Reno work to keep a lid on the incident? Sheriff Fred? Jane Hanlin? The school district? All three?

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      All 3! Don’t forget Franks input. He was there on day 2or 3 of investigation with JH & Ofc R. Private meeting. Testified to in PC hearing. Which as APA, is why he should have taken his most likely client given advice… NO COMMENT!

      Reply
  152. Alchemist

    Mark March 19, 2013 at 10:32 am

    When I first learned of this incident and Prinie’s efforts to shine a light on it, it evoked a visceral response. I’ve seen the same pattern of community denial and enablement surrounding the “sacred” athletes whose behavior should land them in the legal system. I did not want to comment until the trial concluded. My worst fear was that the judge would let the players slide.

    That was the worst fear for everyone. That is why it was so important to have an independent prosecutor and an independent judge. As long as you had a local judge, and a local prosecutor, particularly one with with close ties to the school board, you could never be assured that justice was going to be done.

    And so for the two players, football is now a foregone conclusion. And for some people, this is a travesty.

    The recent threats to JD and the reactions to the incriminating text messages indicate the deep denial and dysfunction in Steubenville.

    With all due respect, this is not just a Steubenville problem, and not even solely an American problem — this is a problem endemic, in some degree or other, to Western culture as a whole

    The most interesting part of the text messages involves Coach Reno’s actions to cover up the crime. It’s evident that he knew and had been in contact with the players. In order for the cover up to work, it takes two to tango, so to speak.

    And so I awake today with the burning question of the day: With whom did Coach Reno work to keep a lid on the incident? Sheriff Fred? Jane Hanlin? The school district? All three?

    That, my friend, is the $64,000 question. Perhaps the Grand Jury investigation will provide some answers.

    Reply
  153. C Morgan

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2295853/Teen-girls-death-threats-Steubenville-rape-victim-held-custody-protect-victim-immediate-harm.html

    And the cyber bullies go down! A wonderful message to send our youth… You can & should be held accountable for your public words! Better late than never /:
    Now perhaps they need to make an example of some adults too?? (Just see Prinnie on that note!)
    I truly think this is a huge win for the cause of anti-bullying!! With so many eyes upon.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      A cautionary tale to parents too! Monitor your kids social media… & texting!

      Prinnie can help with this professionally. (:

      Reply
      1. John Lewis

        The fact that action has been taken so swiftly against these girls for offences committed on social media should set a clear precedent meaning that all those young men (whether or not the “immune three” are included) who shared offensive and illegal material will also be bought to trial.

        Mind you the girls probably weren’t footballers.

        Reply
        1. C Morgan

          I agree. The obvious sexist approach to crime was not missed. Thanks for pointing out, I’m glad you caught it. I didn’t want to be all negative in regards to story. But the reality of, it’s very much there, and should not be ignored. It gives yet another glimpse of what is wrong in that portion of the community.

          Reply
        2. maddadof2grls

          I know the girls have done wrong but I feel that the individuals handing this case should be ashamed to call themselves community leaders . Why couldn’t handle the boys in the previous case with the same swiftness. Where are the character witnesses now? These girls need to go home to there families while they await their punishment??

          Reply
  154. C Morgan

    @ Leigh L,
    Per your earlier comment on drink or no drink. And re the text on feeding her alcohol like water in trial texts.
    I too was surprised it was only read in passing?? But perhaps the judge caught it, and it weighed in his decision. Stuck out to me like neon lights flashing!
    I still question the dirty sprite theory, a fave of that circle. Sprite & codeine cough syrup/ or NyQuil like syrup,& jolly rancher for taste. Mixed with alcohol would make a person ill! It would also render them coma like in sleep if enough is absorbed. I have seen & noted ref’s to by them. Alone it causes high with hallucinations etc… Stupid kids playing with fire!
    There are still circulating rumors she was plAced in the trunk at one point crossing state lines. Idk?? But has been ruled out…

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Has NOT*

      Reply
      1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

        C Morgan, I did not know if it even came out at trial that the boys were tying to feed more alcohol to an already incapacitated girl. It certainly goes to the premeditation aspect, IMO. Did anyone address the life and death issue of potential alcohol poisoning?

        I have wondered a lot about the many potential “date-rape” drugs, like dirty sprite, which could have caused some of the symptoms (like extremely rapid deterioration) experienced by Jane Doe. I have real concerns about the rape testing policies at the hospital, where the victim reportedly declined the rape kit because it was considered invasive. The lab tests for drugs, particularly hair samples and urine tests would not generally be described as invasive. I wonder if the procedures and tests were fully and accurately described by informed professionals, trained to be supportive advocates of rape victims. I guess we’ll never know.

        Reply
  155. Alchemist

    @John Lewis March 19, 2013 at 4:26 pm

    The fact that action has been taken so swiftly against these girls for offences committed on social media should set a clear precedent meaning that all those young men (whether or not the “immune three” are included) who shared offensive and illegal material will also be bought to trial.

    Mind you the girls probably weren’t footballers.

    What I found most interesting are two things: first, that Sheriff Abdalla was notified by phone of these threats by a woman in Texas. This was done before Judge Lipps had even left the building, and while AG DeWine was still conducting his press conference. The second item that was surprising was that both girls are charged with witness intimidation, as well as menacing in one girl’s case, and aggravated menacing in the other’s. Witness intimidation is a felony, while the other charges are misdemeanors. Both girls have been ordered held in custody until March 27th, when their next hearing will be conducted.

    To a degree, what is happening here is blowback from the frenzy of publicity surrounding the rape trial. The widespread belief that local justice is corrupt, or that they will somehow be soft on offenders has caused them to double-down, to demonstrate that this is not indeed the case. Thus they are being harsher than they ordinary might have been. Not a good time to attract attention to oneself.

    Reply
  156. C Morgan

    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/the-stranahan-bruzzese-connection-confirmed/
    Sorry being a blog hog, but the info just keeps coming out! And this one… Considering he has broadcasted so-called details of the case on his blog, considering he’s APA. Considering he involved himself in the case early on… Idk but could be a question of ethics here??

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      The first consider meant for blogger, although he was pretty vocal too!
      The other 2 are all Frank.

      Reply
  157. sicnangry

    I’m sure everyone has seen the media blitz from Jake Howarths father today. I don’t know if this is for real or a bad joke, but if you look Jake Howarth on Twitter, scroll to March 15, “best birthday gift I ever Received” #ThanksDad, click on View Photo. He’s a freshman in a college dorm and is in possession of that?? He’s 19 yrs old, is that even legal?

    Reply
    1. WeirSteuben

      I don’t think that is the same Jake Howarth from Steubenville.

      Reply
  158. sicnangry

    Thank you for pointing that out and thank god it isn’t him.

    Reply
  159. arc

    now we know what is US legal system…..

    Reply
  160. Mark

    Alchemist and CMorgan, thanks for your replies and insights. I agree on all counts, and with regard to Alchemist’s observation, I didn’t mean to indict Steubenville alone. It does, indeed, happen elsewhere.

    I should explain my visceral response. I live in Oregon, where I moved 25 years ago. I was shocked to see how the local authorities (schools, law enforcement, the judicial system, and the media) handled crimes committed by juveniles. At first I simply thought the legal system was radically different than California’s (my home state). Ah. my naivete…

    So what did I observe? In a nutshell. non prosecution of felonies: arson, vandalism, assault, weapons, ad nauseam. I had moved here to teach in one of Portland’s suburbs. The very first year, a couple of kids from my school trashed and set fire to a couple of classrooms at the elementary school next door. They were never charged. The head of the school board, Sherri Calouri, was also the chief spokesperson of the Washington County Sheriff’s office and a fully deputized sheriff to boot. I learned that when kids who come from a preferred background got in trouble, the district would contact Sherri, who would then drop or bury the case. I call this the miracle of one phone call fixes all. Into the ether went the incidents. If you contacted the sheriff and the district attorney, they would state that they had no record of anything having happened. If you contacted the school district, the p.r. person would give a similar response. I contacted The Oregonian to ask why no story was ever printed. Their reply: the school district said that nothing happened. So much for a lack of curiosity (when the smell of barbequed classrooms wafted through the neighborhood), the very same trait which seems to plague the Steubenville case. If you managed to corner a district level administrator about why the kids were being handled in an opaque, extra judicial manner, the reply would be, “It’s a community value.” If you loudly criticized their actions, you would get a reply that the special treatment was fine (i.e., allowed under the law) because a school district psychologist was “working” with the kids. You would also get the reply, “OUR kids can’t succeed with YOUR negative attitude.” The ultimate retort would be, “If you really want to see problems, go look at the kids in the Portland school district.” A smack down of retribution was also right around the corner…

    In the early ’90’s we had a sensational murder committed by Conrad Engeweiler, a student who raped, sodomized, and murdered his neighbor, a fellow student. Thanks to the school district’s back room dealings, Conrad’s case was routed to juvenile court. It took loud protests and the intervention of the court’s presiding judge to move the case to adult court, where the case should automatically have gone, as the charge of aggravated murder, when applied to youths, required no determination of where the case should have been routed.

    It wasn’t long before I learned that other students benefited from this form of divine intervention. The protected class was mostly white, wealthy, and participated in sports. You could usually see the parents of such kids hanging around the schools, starting to create a narrative that their child was a Rhodes Scholar candidate and the prodigy who would lead the local high school to a state championship in either football or hoops. This is the basis of what I refer to as the jockocracy. Aside from the false and deceitful narratives masquerading as success, it was pathetic to see grown adults living their lives vicariously through their child.

    I came away from this and realized that there is a dynamic at work. For the greater glory of the community. as manifested only through football and hoops, the public image needed to be preserved at all costs.
    The louder and more often the superintendent, the sheriff, and the d.a.could utter the word “success,” one would not look beneath the carpet to see the ugly truth. Sing Kumbaya and pass the taxy levy.

    I was truly surprised that none of the defense attorneys in the Steubenville case had the temerity to state to Judge Lipps that the prosecution was wrong because the suspects were losing out on the best part of their lives, the potential stigma was morally wrong, and that playing football was the best form of accountability and discipline. Nor would I have been surprised to see Judge Lipps accept such arguments. I’m also surprised that the defense didn’t employ a battery of psychobabble spouting shrinks to testify that some mysterious, vague, and ill defined mental condition was the root cause of their behavior.

    So, is such a dynamic still alive in my neck of the woods? Probably. I am heartened and encouraged because technology and media have advanced to such a point where evidence, now so easily collected and archived, is damning, and the fraudulent nature of all denials is soundly exposed.

    The use of “community values” to justify the intransigence is not simply wrong, but it is illegal as well. There’s nothing in the state’s regulatory statutes that says that “community values” may be invoked to avoid prosecuting crimes. (I have been searching for that sacred stone upon which the precept is carved. Still haven’t found it, either.) As many have noted, school officials, the sheriff, and the d.a. have a sworn duty to uphold the law. Strange then that “community values” may be conveniently invoked?

    The silence of the media, its willingness to restate whatever pabulum is spoon fed to it by the various p.r. flacks, and its unwillingness to investigate the glaring inconsistencies, amounts to complicity, as does the unwillingness of the state to investigate the obvious, illegal dynamic that’s at work on the local levels of government. In my interpretation, it says to me that all of the involved parties, right up to the governor of the state, Oregon or Ohio, are going to do their damndest to preserve the staus quo for the sake of image and the jobs of high ranking officials.

    A series of outrageous cases involving juveniles who received extremely lenient consequences led Oregon to pass Measure 11 in 1994. Measure 11 is a minimum mandatory sentencing guideline for violent crimes. Persons aged 15 or older are subject. So, while I suspect that back room dealing is still going on, the ability to document and publicize crimes provides the ability to expose which parts of the system have worked actively to prevent the due course of justice. Against the backdrop of Measure 11, it’s much more difficult for officials to rationalize why criminals aren’t being charged or prosecuted.

    There is still a great deal that has yet to play out or to be revealed about how the Steubenville case turned into a cluster—-. While I am happy that DeWine will convene a grand jury, it remains to be seen as to who, beyond the other kids involved that night, will be indicted. Paranoid me harbors the suspicion that “No Harm, No Foul” may yet be the outcome, leaving the intervention of Federal officials to be the last resort.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      Thanks Mark for sharing your similar experience of corruption and cronyism. It serves to remind us, these pockets of communities exist far and wide. I intend to add further thought regarding your experiences. (:

      Reply
  161. Kellenanthony

    Mark – phew – preachin to another in the choir that goes coast to coast. I originally responded earlier in this story here on Prinnie – because I had a knee-jerk triggered trauma reaction to folks thinking things like Steubenville are just relegated to places like Steubenville. Over time I’ve been able to collect myself as this matter unfolded. And I was just at least glad people are starting to see elements of what are highlighted by the Steubenville matter are viral problems coast to coast.

    Ironic for me is that now it’s leapt onto the pages about a CT town. My horror began in that town (unrelated to that present story) and I was a nightdesk editor at the paper that broke the story. These things just come closer and closer to home – and anyone who has lived through trauma from violent crimes knows the trigger and flooding that can dredge up.

    What you reiterate is so true. The town where my situation happened – is the opposite of the demographics in Steubenville. But the same elements of the story otherwise. I originally posted on Prinnie about that. It frightened me to see that story lean towards demographics. It’s more like a camping fire. The wood, kindling, wind and flame igniting are the factors. Things you more eloquently point out in your post. If people saw this for what it is – and incited change – it has to help. If people really care about victims of crime of all ages and victim blaming, corruption, on and on.

    The tony town I am speaking of had the right wood, kindling, wind and fire I refer to. PBA police president, football (coach and player), bully kids, bully adults (all rallying around a perpetrator for self-gain), school board elected official involved, judges, cops as stalkers for friends, you name it. And a ‘target’ (I hate the word victim right now, just a personal issue since I am living this) – facing an uphill battle for justice. Bystander effect. Yikes, you name it. It’s like the same puzzle pieces, just a different geographical puzzle board. In fact, this town is so tony and connected – I wouldn’t be surprised if the Times would balk at covering it.

    When I saw Dewine’s press conference – like so many watching I felt a lot of emotions. But when you are a person – a Jane Doe – from another situation similar – you, or at least I thought: so there it is, that state was forced to follow basic laws we all expect as citizens. In my case right now advocates and I are met with ‘complexity’ and ‘oh wow, that’s a lot of resources to have to use’ etc. To me, watching Dewine I thought ‘well, at least someone got someone to make the system kick in – late or not.’

    Corruption like this it seems grows like a weed when it’s untended is all. Systems that have checks and balances – catch this stuff. People and communities are like onions though and when tragedy or misfortune or plain and simple Crime peel those layers back – its then that the light shows all the cracks beneath.

    Good post was what I was getting at – Mark.

    Reply
    1. Kellenanthony

      … and I just wanted to add (in what-a-small-world this is way) that the police force in the CT town now in the news where a tragedy is being compared to the Steubenville matter – was to me a factor in my surviving orginally. In other words: that force had its major problems in the past (before my time there) but during the nascence of my horror when I lived there they were top notch. Well trained, and knew exactly how to handle what happened to me then. I moved to NJ to escape the perpetrator and the town I moved to is where ‘the rest’ went down. It was in this new town the Wild Wild West was the norm. Where the pieces of this Steubenville puzzle exist. I just didn’t want to not give credit where it was due to the police in the CT town. I’ve no idea what happened once I left that town, over a decade ago, however.

      Too: it is ‘mean girl’ behavior like an article posted below implies. But grown women can make the same choices, sadly, when a victim of a crime turns to whom they trust most. It’s an odd phenom. And it makes it that much worse for the victim as we know. So many sociology type things go wrong when tragedy strikes. It really does unfortunately take a few brave souls to go ‘outside the norm’ and rise up.

      And so far as screen shotting victim bashing as ‘animal’ behavior – I’ve got some I recieved and turned into authorities that would make your head spin. Some from teens but a lot from adults. The adult ones are worse than the teens.

      Sorry. Didn’t mean to hijack. I just get really concerned that the lessons of Steubenville not be overlooked in full. Everywhere. All these things can happen in any town – coast to coast. It’s awareness that starts the ball rolling in a better direction to change that. And for people to care. Anywhere. Everywhere.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        Kellan,
        Just wanted to say, I admire your strength, that clearly echoes from your words as a survivor. I appreciate your willingness to share a very personal tragedy. May you only continue to heal, and not allow it to cast a shadow upon your present & future days.

        I can only hope with the world’s eyes on Steubenville, it will serve to raise further awareness, on the multi problematic issues in our society. And that many of the norm defying problems there, are certainly not all unique to.

        Mark,
        She said it so very well, that I got nothing i could add to. (:

        Reply
      2. maddgramma

        Kellen, Thank You for sharing your story with us. I will keep you in my prayers. You are one courages lady. May God Bless You and Yours.

        Reply
      3. Mark

        Kellen, thank you for your courageous reply. I take no satisfaction in knowing that this is a large, systemic problem throughout the country.
        As the behavior of the involved authorities continues to draw scrutiny, questions, and criticisms, and as long as the word “corruption” won’t cross the lips of those who uphold our laws, I am reminded of the question from the Roman satirist Juvenal : Who will guard the guards themselves?
        Nearly two thousand years later the question remains highly appropriate.

        Reply
  162. C Morgan

    Just wanted to share this article link. Drawing attention to a subject that bothered many of us. Both boys and girls that were bystanders, & thus technically a part to the rape, should be held accountable.
    But Call it girl-code, sisterhood, or whatever… this crime had many struggling to understand how the girls could so carelessly ignore another in obvious need of help. Or any minimal effort, to hastily be withdrawn, for only selfish & vengeful reasons.
    Additionally the cyber bullies, and superficial so-called best friends. Friends that are only weak, and would sacrifice a friendship just to follow the crowd. And/or protect their dating pool aka. rape crews.

    http://www.cnn.com/2013/03/20/opinion/simmons-steubenville-girls/index.html?c=&page=2

    Reply
  163. Mark

    And here’s the latest from Frankie B. Please look at the tone of his comment. I wonder if Coach Reno has Frankie’s back? Or is it the other way around?

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/special-judge-appointed-in-ohio-to-handle-grand-jury-investigation-into-steubenville-rape-case/2013/03/21/33c45fb0-924a-11e2-9173-7f87cda73b49_story.html

    Reply
    1. thinkin man

      Pretty bad when the Washington Post can’t get the judge’s name right – Frank is not a judge (in the real world.)

      Reply
  164. me

    Mark,
    You have it all wrong. Frank Bruzzese is not a judge. It was Judge Joseph Bruzzese that requested an outside judge to handle the grand jury.

    Reply
  165. LinT

    I believe Joseph is Frank’s brother..

    Reply
    1. thinkin man

      True. The Post made the correction.

      Reply
  166. PhilC

    “The time is always right to do what is right.” MLK Jr. Thank you for standing up for Jane Doe.

    Reply
  167. Eric

    Did Michael Nodianos commit suicide, or is this just a rumor?

    Reply
  168. IknowSteubenville

    Prinnie, Glad to hear everything went well. I was wondering if you, or one of the other extremely knowledgeable individuals on here could explain the basics regarding a grand jury for those of us whose only experience with one is from watching Law and Order. I’m sure most of us average Joe’s would appreciate a mini-course in this area.

    Reply
  169. C Morgan

    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/fuzzy-math-of-immunity-deals-5-2/comment-page-1/#comment-20547
    More Harold Star breaking it down for us common brain folks, who smell something’s off here, (and that we’re here to our credit!) but struggle to pinpoint it, or communicate it…

    @IKS, I will give it a shot next, as I know many are busy… & the crap out there just keeps coming! Twitter land is a whole other ongoing fight for many from truth oppressors. Insanity out there!! Twitter jail needs to add another floor for Twitter Asylum!

    Reply
  170. C Morgan

    Per PQ1’s helpful find…

    So a Grand Jury can convict or simply investigate and then make recommendations for conviction?
    Grand Juries don’t convict people they just look at information and see if there is enough evidence to charge someone with a crime.

    Q: How does a grand jury operate?
    A: In carrying out its two functions of reviewing criminal charges which have been brought by police and prosecutors and conducting investigations of possible criminal behavior, the grand jury meets in secret, behind closed doors. Its proceedings are usually one-sided, and are very different from a trial. Unlike a public trial, the accused person is not present (unless he or she is called as a witness), nor is his/her counsel present (even if he is called as a witness). Also, witnesses are not cross-examined. Not even a judge is present in the grand jury room, although a judge will be contacted if a witness refuses to answer a question and the prosecutor wishes to cite the witness for contempt.

    The prosecutor presents the state’s case by asking the witness questions. The grand jurors also may ask questions, but neither the actual eyewitness to an alleged crime nor the alleged victim of that crime need to appear as witnesses. The rules that apply in court to exclude most hearsay evidence (evidence provided by someone who did not actually witness the crime) do not apply in the grand jury room. Therefore, a police officer may simply testify as to what eye-witnesses and alleged victims have said.

    Further, information obtained by illegal police investigation, unconstitutional surveillance, or by unreliable means, can be heard and relied upon by grand jurors, even though that information would not be admissible if the case proceeded to trial. Finally, even if a prosecutor knows of information which would help show that the accused person is innocent, he is not required to present it to the grand jury. So, while two sides are presented in a trial, it may be that only one side will be presented in a grand jury proceeding.

    Grand jury proceedings usually remain secret, unless a witness chooses to disclose what happened in the grand jury room while he/she was testifying. Conclusions made by a grand jury are made known by what it does: a grand jury issues a bill of indictment if it finds probable cause to believe both that a crime has been committed and that the accused person is responsible, or a “no-bill” if it does not find probable cause. The grand jury also may issue a report at the conclusion of its term, in which its members may make recommendations about improving the justice system.

    Q: What does it mean when someone is “indicted”?
    A: Just because someone is indicted does not mean he or she is guilty of any crime. As described above, the grand jury process is simply a means of charging someone with a crime, and the grand jury’s decisions are based merely on probable cause. The grand jury’s decisions are not held to the much higher standard of proof beyond a reasonable doubt that must apply to convict a person at a trial. Further, the nature of the evidence the grand jury may rely on is quite different, and little if any defense information is presented. One can expect, therefore, that the grand jury will charge many more people than will be convicted. That is its function–to initiate and, to a limited extent, screen cases to determine which should go forward.

    Q: What happens if a person is indicted?
    A: An indicted person will enter a plea to the charges. If a person proceeds to trial, he or she is presumed innocent. It will then be the trial judge or jury, a different body, which will decide whether or not to convict. That decision will be made only after all of the lawfully admitted evidence from both sides has been heard and it is determined that the accused person is guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

    11/12/2012
    https://www.ohiobar.org/forpublic/re…canuse-86.aspx

    Reply
  171. Alchemist

    Most of you will doubtless remember Steubenville Jill, everyone’s favorite character on the recent Dr. Phil show — she of the ‘tents made out of desks complete with children pooping and peeing out of fear’.

    Being somewhat sorrowful that the spotlight has now shone elsewhere, she decided to drown her sorrows, and got caught driving under the influence. When you check the Municipal Court records, using the following URL, and search on the case number, 13TRC00425, you will find that our heroine, Steubenville Jill is indeed slated for trial on April 10, 2013.

    http://webconnect03.civicacmi.com/steubenvilleMC/court/lookup.xsp

    Here is an image of the court record, from the court website: http://postimg.org/image/smznjq92r/

    Reply
  172. gunnerguy55

    Has any one else noticed the elephant in the corner of the room????
    The steubenville board of ED. Is in the same room . and guess who the the big fella IS? WHAT ARE THEY WAITING FOR

    Reply
    1. margie

      Exactly, and speaking of Ed. Dept. Where the heck has the State Dept. of Ed been on this (they do fund local Ed depts.) Nowhere. We’ve not heard a single comment from the big shots in Columbus that are over the local board. They shoud have been all over this by now, but we the taxpayers, who pay the nice salaries, hear nothing from them. Time for them to come out of hiding as did the AG finally. We want answers.

      Reply
  173. gunnerguy55

    The only thing that worry’s me ( having been a grand juror ) is; the selection of (my) panel of jurors was done by the jefferson county officials, and the same questions are asked of all perspective jurors.
    Doesn’t sound too hokey , but in that short session , I believe the weeding -out takes place. (Again I was a juror ) A lot can be told of a person in a short time
    There was a total of 25 + in my juror pool 12 were chosen
    I hope for the best and THE TRUTH That Attorney General’s office does the selection of this Grand jury.

    Reply
  174. C Morgan

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/mobileweb/comments/2938610/fp/44/?icid=hp_crime_art_comment
    Article Pointing out the morality issues here. 

    And My two cents…
    One would only have to spend a little time perusing Twitter Land, amid some common names and associations, to visualize better the full implication of the article’s topic. Or maybe I should say, before the majority recently went on lockdown. Kids who brazenly criticize and degrade each other and themselves, male & female included. Who Boast of a variety of inappropriate actions, and yes even other illegal activities. Drinking is the least concerning of.
    But the recent switch to more obscure life narratives, gives an even larger insight into the roots of the underlying issue here. It’s not that the morally bankrupt suddenly developed filters and a conscience. Not at all. It’s really about the world is watching. And that gave rise to a “new sheriff in town,” given the unprecedented, youth law enforcing atmosphere of late. 
    We can hope contributing to change, are parents supervising, and holding their kids accountable for choices, words, and actions?? Yet Some of the parents are guilty of similar unacceptable public displays, and still continue to. 
    Consider one only has to look at just one night, of undeniably many before and since to some degree, to see the overall picture. We can hope it’s a forced change upon of societal norms. That it’s not the giant fishbowl has only put up some curtains in the aftermath?
    But when I read or see, the continued denial by parents of any and all culpability. And their continued defense, along with family and friends, on behalf of so many who did contribute to a travesty. Worst of all, the continued lack of remorse or empathy for Jane Doe by most of. Common sense tells me, life as usual, but more hidden from view, is more the status quo here. 
    However one can ascertain how these children’s moral compasses, or lack there of, were engineered. But to actually understand any of it, still escapes me. 

    Reply
  175. C Morgan

    Omg! I truly am only posting this link to expose a pathetic article, by a woman! It only gives further proof of a portion of society’s rape enabling Mindset! I made it through the first 15 or so comments, that TG are all lashing out at the author. Is she really this immoral & ignorant, or attention seeking a trending story & victimizing JD further to get it?! Either are disgusting!!
    http://www2.macleans.ca/2013/03/23/land-mines-in-our-sexual-landscape/

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      C Morgan, I went to the link you posted and I am shaking with rage over what the woman wrote about rape and about filmed child rape for child porn. There are no words for my disgust. I hope if you are on Twitter you’ll join me on March 28’s Tweetathon against child sexual abuse. I tweet in my same name, @DenverElle.

      Reply
      1. C Morgan

        I will absolutely (:
        What a Truly horrid woman she is for sure! My chin was on the floor, & not too Far into reading. Comments lowered my BP a little, I was afraid they were going to be agreements! Phew!

        Thanks Alchemist, sounds like a perfect match those 2!

        Reply
  176. Alchemist

    C Morgan March 25, 2013 at 11:14 pm

    Omg! I truly am only posting this link to expose a pathetic article, by a woman! It only gives further proof of a portion of society’s rape enabling Mindset! I made it through the first 15 or so comments, that TG are all lashing out at the author. Is she really this immoral & ignorant, or attention seeking a trending story & victimizing JD further to get it?! Either are disgusting!!
    http://www2.macleans.ca/2013/03/23/land-mines-in-our-sexual-landscape/

    Barbara Amiel is probably not terribly well known to American readers; she is, unfortunately, depressingly familiar to Canadians. She is the wife of Conrad Black, former newspaper baron. Conrad was one of the 1% — he is (in)famous in Canada for raiding the pension funds belonging to the workers of the Dominion Store grocery chain, which went into bankruptcy or receivership. Black wanted/needed the money, and for some unknown reason this was perfectly legal, so he did it. It didn’t matter that the money actually belonged to the workers of that doomed grocery chain — Black looted the pension fund without so much as a by your leave. That’s the kind of person Conrad is, and his wife is no better.

    Mr. Black was convicted in a Chicago court or some financial improprieties, for which he served some 3.5 years in a Florida prison. He famously renounced his Canadian citizenship a few years back, because then-Prime Minister Chretien refused to allow Black to be inducted into the British peerage, so he could take a seat in the UK House of Lords. Once Black was convicted in an American court, he was no longer welcome in the House of Lords. After serving his prison sentence, he returned to Canada on a Ministerial permit, which he had to obtain, as he is no longer a Canadian citizen, with an automatic right of return.

    Barbara Amiel Black is so right-wing, it’s a wonder that she doesn’t topple over. I suspect she would be pretty-much at home even in today’s uber-misogynistic Republican party. That might explain some of her attitudes.

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      Alchemist, I’ve read some pretty horrific things about abuse and rape lately, but this woman made me want to throw up. The excuses she makes for child porn are beyond the pale. I’d never heard of her so I do appreciate your explanation of her mindset. I really hope there are not many more like her in this world. If there is any bright light in this, the majority of the article’s commenters seemed to be as stunned and appalled as we are.

      Reply
  177. Alice

    Here’s something else that’s in the paper today.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/26/world/middleeast/egyptian-women-blamed-for-sexual-assaults.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_th_20130326&_r=0

    Read the comment by Martha Shelley. She mentions Steubenville in her comment.

    I’ve been thinking about the non-apology made by Mays after the trial to JD and families. (So very lame, by the way.) He apologized for taking and sharing pictures. That’s all. He obviosly felt he had a right to her body; to do with as he desired. Maybe he and JD had talked about “hooking up” earlier in the week or that evening, and he felt that everything he had done, plus that of his friends, was permissible.

    I see this culture inwhich it is OK and encourages (and celebrates) it’s young men being sexually active. It’s an indication of masculinity. But the same isn’t true for it’s female population. If a young woman is sexually active and she is raped, then it is just viewed as sex, maybe just sex where she got a little more than she bargained for. Oh, and then she’s a slut. This seems to be the opinion that I’m getting from this slice of the teenage population and others, like the case in Connecticut. What I am seeing is that it is wrong for women to desire sex and if she does, she’s a slut so therefore if she is raped, it isn’t a crime because she has a vagina. OMFG

    What ever the opinions, be it based in religious ideals or what, it is still someone else having the final say in how a woman should dress, act and feel. It is misogyny. In any case, not much seperates this group of Steubenville boys or any ‘ville” boys from the hateful men of Egypt or India. (Just because I have a car in the driveway, doesn’t mean you can take it for a drive.)

    Rape is not sex.

    Reply
    1. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

      Alice, you really make valid points, here, as did the Times comment by Martha Shelley. I do hate that women would be only classified as either “pure pristine merchandize,” or “fair game.” It is preposterous to think that once a woman or girl has chosen to have a consensual sex life she somehow is made permanently despoiled, available to any and all for the taking! It doesn’t say much for the quality of the sex lives of the men (or women) who believe that is real sex. After all, good sex is about what two willing (or better yet, enthusiastic!) individuals know to share it. It is not even related to whatever that thing is that an unwanted bully tries to “get” (or more accurately, steal) through rape.

      Reply
  178. Alchemist

    Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle) March 26, 2013 at 1:38 am

    Alchemist, I’ve read some pretty horrific things about abuse and rape lately, but this woman made me want to throw up. The excuses she makes for child porn are beyond the pale. I’d never heard of her so I do appreciate your explanation of her mindset. I really hope there are not many more like her in this world.

    Unfortunately, there are many more, most of whom are in the Republican Party/Tea Party.

    If there is any bright light in this, the majority of the article’s commenters seemed to be as stunned and appalled as we are.

    If you read Amiel’s article closely, you will see that she makes mention of Tom Flanagan. Flanagan was one of the leading lights in the Canadian political scene, being active in both the Reform (and later Conservative) parties. He made some comments (which were surreptiously recorded, then posted to YouTube) during a lecture about his (Libertarian) views on child pornography, which resulted in him:

    * Being asked to reture from his University of Calgary post

    * Being sacked fromt he Conservative party

    * Being sacked frm the Alberta Conservative party.

    Flanagan is now effectively persona non-grata as far as the Canadian political elite is concerned.

    See: http://www.huffingtonpost.ca/2013/02/28/tom-flanagan-child-porn_n_2780550.html

    Amiel clearly saw what happened to Flanagan — perhaps she feels she is immune to similar treatment because she is a woman? I don’t know, but I suspect this is the case.

    Reply
  179. John Lewis

    Alchemist.

    Speaking as a British resident (so feel free to tell me it’s none of my business), shouldn’t we be keeping politics out of this?

    Reply
  180. Alchemist

    John Lewis March 26, 2013 at 2:03 pm

    Alchemist.

    Speaking as a British resident (so feel free to tell me it’s none of my business), shouldn’t we be keeping politics out of this?

    John, my point was not to introduce politics into the discussion; it was to introduce Barbara Amiel-Black’s background so people could understand who the party was who was making such outrageous statements. Ideally, this discussion should transcend politics — this is about rape/sexual abuse, which should really know no political bounds. That said, however, just look at some of what came out of the Republican Party /Tea Party candidates in the last American election. Discussions of “legitimate rape” and so forth. Whether we like it or not, one of the two American political parties is clearly beyond the pale when it comes to misogyny. Let’s face it, there is a reason that the Tea Party (and to a lesser extent, the Republican Party) are called the “American Taliban”.

    Reply
  181. John Lewis

    This has been a refreshing and worthwhile forum for people from all backgrounds and indeed countries united together in opposition to the events in Steubenville and the reaction of many in that community.

    As it has now moved on to politics I will be taking no further part.

    Reply
  182. Alchemist

    John Lewis March 26, 2013 at 2:38 pm

    This has been a refreshing and worthwhile forum for people from all backgrounds and indeed countries united together in opposition to the events in Steubenville and the reaction of many in that community.

    As it has now moved on to politics I will be taking no further part.

    Please stay. There will be no further discussion of politics, at least from me. There are plenty of other discussion forums for that.

    Alchemist

    Reply
  183. We Won the American Revolution

    Alchemist from abroad:Thank you for backing off from injecting your poitical views. I for one was very offended by your TeaParty/taliban remark. You know not of what you speak, let us now leave it at that.

    Reply
  184. Leigh LaFon (@DenverElle)

    John, I too hope you will remain on this forum. I do think the subject of rape, in particular, will automatically bring some consideration of politics into play. When we discuss rape, we usually mean the crime committed by a male against a female, and historically women’s rights were not equal to men’s, so social and sexual equality and how women are viewed, becomes interwoven with the topic. Religion, which is currently playing a huge role in politics, can also be part of the issue of rape’s perception, and that was one point Alchemist made. When the rape victim and perpetrator are both male, that may be considered by some to be a much more serious offense depending on the viewer’s politics, religion, sex or culture. I think it would have caused a different reaction in Steubenville, for example. Few would have thought a passed out boy was “asking for it” because he got drunk.

    I’ll try to remain non-partisan here, but I do think Alchemist’s description in particular of Canadian blogger Barbara Amiel’s background in politics should not be too inflammatory for British or US readers.

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      How true that is! I believe the perpetrators would have been placed in stockades at the center of town, and stoned to death. IMO
      I’ve seen some of the same cyber attacking others for sexual orientation. Just saying.

      Reply
  185. C Morgan

    I had no knowledge of who the author of the article was at posting. It was never the agenda. It was a heinous example of a rape enabling viewpoint, by a woman, made it more vile. 
    It’s a parallel for the far too many local mindset, void of societal norms. This piece gave a disturbing insight into the opposing thought process of a like minded individual. To better clarify of those who articulate their stance by using only degrading names of victim, pity for convicted rapists’ football careers, and support of an alleged criminal coach among others. Further by attacking supporters with frivolous and irrelevant topics to deflect. 
    Yet ultimately those of us with integrity, intellect, strong moral compasses, and common sense may never truly understand it!
    Alchemist only clarified who this author was. As any form of a public figure elsewhere, is a little concerning. And simply included some detailed history behind it, that may or may not help explain her views. He has always done a great job in fact checking, clarifying, or further food for thought of topic. 
    Thus there really isn’t any political agenda here. Very local “politics,” is the exception. I believe most only wish to see justice completed.

    Reply
  186. C Morgan

    Who didn’t see this one coming?? I think long ago I made a ref that if Feds came in after to clean house… Watch how quick they start selling each other out in immunity & plea deals! Lol
    Gives “Rat Race” a new meaning ( great movie! (: ) wonder if there is a pool taking wagers on who goes down & who’s a snitch?! :b

    This is classic…
    [Sir williamfuld:
    March 26th, 2013 at 9:17 pm
    And are you perhaps a descendent of the late Madame Roma?
    Bet my Ouija board against your tarot cards that stuff is going to happen, perhaps even to some of your “associates.”
    Hint:Ouija says….power people prepared to offer up certain sacrificial lambs. Other words, some getting thrown under proverbial bus, yet again, to save select few
    That is all Ouija cares to divulge at this time.
    Update April 14]

    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/facebook-event-page-we-stand-behind-reno-sac/comment-page-1/#comment-21049

    Reply
  187. Nite_Visitor

    This is all very interesting. Why is it that Steubenville courts have to have so many trials for all these cases ?? First, an inquiry , then a pretrial, next comes another inquiry and finally the actual trial / hearing . If Steubenville can’t think of anything better to spend the taxpayer’s money on , I can suggest a number of streets and roads in need of repair !! What’s all this ‘ house arrest ‘ about ? Don’t we remember a recent incident where someone on ‘ house arrest ‘ was permitted to attend a football game in California ? Now two girls threaten JD and are again AWARDED house arrest . Is the senior prom coming up ? Are there cheerleader tryouts scheduled ? Betcha neither of these girls miss out on any of the activities planned for the remaining school year.

    Reply
  188. C Morgan

    All For A Winning Season?

    When people are placed upon pedestals, inevitably they will fall.
    There are skeptics that still refuse to consider Big Red’s Coach Reno Saccoccia, allegedly committed any crimes in the wake of the August 2012 rape of Jane Doe. In spite of the trial evidence to the contrary, and the cloud of suspicion of a cover up hanging over Steubenville since the beginning.
    The Attorney General’s order of a Grand Jury Full Investigation, just might build upon the existing evidence. The Coach, rumored to be one of the most powerful locals, could in fact be indicted on charges.
    And although Reno may have done positive things in years past, his legacy may be overshadowed by one alleged ruthless decision and resulting illegal actions. 
    What is most concerning if this proves true, is the blatant disregard for one very victimized young girl. Never a pertinent factor of how this would impact her feelings, reputation, credibility, her overall life! And that speaks volumes about his true character. 
    In reality the nature of some who possess inflated egos, render assistance to others, only when they stand to gain from. Thus what potential motive could Reno have had to protect his 2 players, and potentially others, from legal consequences?
    It’s probably best to hear it from his own perspective. So it just so happens that’s possible… I present an in depth interview in an article from August 23, 2012. Coincidentally this interview may very well have occurred in the ten days following the incident? But regardless, as you read through the pre-season comments, possibilities for positions, and team objectives… Some familiar names crop up. And the confident tone of Reno seems there’s plenty of time to pull it all together.
    Courtesy of his avid supporters, we can ascertain his twisted conundrum, for his delivery of a winning season is expected and rewarded.
    So perhaps here in between the lines, Lies the motive, allegedly…

    From: The Intelligencer, Wheeling News-Register, By Ed Looman, Aug 23, 2012.

    [Football 2012: Big Red Will Be Raw, But Still A Contender
    STEUBENVILLE – Reno Saccoccia chose one word to describe his 2012 Steubenville club: Raw.

    *** ”We have some talent, but it is raw with no experience,” said Saccoccia, who is entering his 30th year at the helm of the Crimson and the Black. ”We have zero carries back at tailback and zero snaps back at quarterback.
    *** ”We have a lot of our front line back, but they have not been able to practice together because of illnesses or injuries.”
    A season ago, Saccoccia, who has compiled an amazing 302-53 record, referred to his squad as ”green.” That unit, however, rolled to a perfect regular season and won its first Division III playoff game before dropping a heartbreaker to Youngstown Cardinal Mooney.
    In compiling the 11-1 mark, Big Red scored an average of 37.2 points per game, allowing just 10.7. They rolled to 386 yards an outing while holding the opposition to 196.
    *** If the 2012 squad is going to match those accomplishments, Saccoccia knows there’s lots of work to do.
    (Insert 2012 schedule)
    *PREDICTION
    Win 9, Lose 1
    *** ”On offense, we have to fix our line and get our tailbacks lots of reps,” he noted. ”The one place that I did not do a real good job of last year in preparing for this season was at tailback.
    *** ”Defensively, we are solid at linebacker and solid in the secondary. We’ve got work to do on the defensive line, but we have guys that are willing to do it and work hard.”
    *** Senior Corey Stinson and sophomore Trent Mays were locked in a battle for the starting quarterback spot. They are looking to replace Marcus Prather, who threw for 1,873 yards and 20 touchdowns in one season as a starter. Sophomore Robbie Agresta also is a candidate.
    *** ”They’ve been getting most the snaps,” Saccoccia said. ”I’m not in a real hurry to make a decision because once I pick a starter, that is who I am going to go with. We’ll let it play out; let them get experience and the coaching they need. We’re working them both with the first offense in practice and scrimmages.”
    Five players are in the hunt for time at tailback, a spot handled extremely well in 2011 by JoJo Pierro, who ran for more than 1,000 yards and 18 scores. The five are senior Teshawn Luke, junior Robert Hayden, junior Michael Jett, sophomore Donte Brown and sophomore Jamarty Wise.
    ”We have good speed at tailback and we have good toughness,” Saccoccia said. ”We feel we have the players, we just have to coach them up. We are not going to have a true starting tailback. Hopefully, we will have two or three who can do the job because the top three also will start on defense. The same thing will be true at fullback.”
    *** Senior Dashon Redman is the top candidate at fullback. Joining him at the position are senior Make (sic) Cole, junior Kai McClurg, junior Garon Lytle, sophomore Dondre Brown and sophomore Kylar Davis.
    Saccoccia is excited about the players he has back at the receiving positions.
    ***”We have skilled players back there, five real good receivers,” he pointed out. ”Whatever quarterback we put in there is going to be able to get them the ball. We understand that and we realize we have to work on our running game.”
    *** Players in the mix at split end are senior Matt Petrella, senior Tajuan Lawson, who missed the 2011 season with an injury, sophomore Malik Richmond, junior Perrier Coleman and sophomore Lucas Herrington.
    Petrella was third on the team behind Pierro and Ohio State recruit Najee Murray with 21 grabs for 327 yards and four touchdowns.
    *** Sure-handed senior Evan Westlake (15 catches a season ago) is among four players looking for time at flanker. The others are junior Bryan Pierro, junior Cody Saltsman and sophomore Brad Newburn.
    Saccoccia said his team is ”*solid* at the tight end position,” adding ”we need depth there because of the way we substitute offensively.”
    *** The top returner is senior Eric Robinson, who turned five of his nine 2011 catches into six points. Junior Arin Goldsmith is in the mix along with junior Cameron King.
    All told, Saccoccia has six starters back on offense with several ready to anchor the offensive front.
    Seniors Joe Nation and Luke McCourt return at tackle. They will be backed up by junior Jaylin Williams and sophomore Darien Evans.
    *** Ryan Wood, another senior, is back at guard and will be paired with junior Chris Starlipper, senior Charles Keenan and senior Jeno Atkins.
    *** Keenan also got some starts at center a year ago. Other candidates here are Nation, McCourt and sophomore David Lulla.
    ”We want to two-platoon as much as we can on both the offensive and defensive lines,” Saccoccia said.
    Senior Luke Smith will handle all the kicking chores for Big Red. As a junior, Smith converted on 48 of 49 extra-point tries and 2 of 3 field-goal attempts.
    Five starters are back on defense for Big Red including Petrella (safety), Redman (Mike linebacker), Luke (Will linebacker), Hayden (Sam linebacker) and senior Manard Reed (nose tackle).
    The starting defensive ends will come from the group of senior Torre Carter, Robinson, King, Goldsmith, sophomore Devin Smith and sophomore William Harvey.
    *** Keenan and Williams will see playing time at defensive tackle. Supporting Reed at the nose will be McCourt and sophomore Darrell Solomon.
    Joining Redman at the Mike linebacker spot are McClurg and Donte Brown. Cole and Dondre Brown will support Hayden at the Sam. Luke will get assistance from sophomore Branden Jones and senior Jerrick Shackleford at Will.
    Luke was third on the team in tackles during with 60, trailing only Leshawn Luke and Murray. He also tied departed senior William Houst for the team lead in sacks with three.
    *** Jett, Pierro, Coleman, Lytle and Wise are competing for time at corner. Jett had three interceptions a season ago to lead Big Red. Lawson, Petrella, Saltsman, Richmond, Newburn and sophomore Travis Wolfe will see time at safety.
    ”I was not real happy with the effort we had early in our 10-day camp,” Saccoccia noted. ”However, we have really picked it up and are doing better.
    *** ”Whenever you have a team that lacks experience, you almost feel like they improve at a faster rate and that’s what we need to do is keep improving. Maybe the saying that nothing ever great is achieved without enthusiasm is true. We have enthusiastic, hard-working players.”
    As he prepares for his 30th campaign, Saccoccia said ”I still enjoy it.”
    *** ”I think that the emotions our assistants show help. Emotion is not something I need to have. My goal this year is to be more positive than negative.”
    When asked to discuss his coaching staff, Saccoccia was quick to admit ”I’ve got a great staff.”
    *** ”Our coaches are prepared to take assignments. They take it personal. There is never any down in our practices. Every coach and every player takes pride in what they’re doing and the competition makes us all better.”
    Serving on the Big Red varsity staff are Bob Lamantia, Rick Camilletti, Dan Filtz, Jason Kernahan, Mike Haney, JoJo Saccoccia, Anthony Pierro, Gus DiMarzio and Josh Meyer. Filtz serves as the head junior varsity coach and gets assistance from Meyer and Nate Hubbard.
    *** Joe Pierro directs the freshman team along with Justin Banks, Mike Blackburn, Matt Belardine and Jeremy Pressley. The Harding staff consists of Brian Mills, Brian Pruitt, Duke Jones, Donny Price, Matt Davis, Anthony DeFrances and Seth Fluharty.
    Big Red opens its season tonight when Washington, D.C. Woodrow Wilson comes to town for a 6 o’clock kickoff. Three new opponents dot the 2011 schedule including Buffalo Bishop Timon-St. Jude, Pittsburgh Westinghouse and Sir Wilfrid Laurier from Toronto, Canada. Cleveland Benedictine will provide the opposition in Week 2.***
    *** ”I think it is a pretty tough schedule for a Division-III football team,” Saccoccia said. ”I also think, however, that our coaches and players will be up for the challenge.”]
    http://www.news-register.net/page/content.detail/id/573271/Football-2012–Big-Red-Will-Be-Raw–But-Still-a-Contender.html?nav=5918

    Reply
    1. C Morgan

      It just occurred to me that the date published of article, makes no mention of arising case or arrests. Given it would have undoubtedly put a snag in the detailed game plan… Yet as of Aug. 23, it’s football business as usual. And only Gives further credibility to Prinnie, that local media was bypassing the story.

      Reply
  189. Alchemist

    @We Won the American Revolution March 26, 2013 at 5:28 pm

    Alchemist from abroad:Thank you for backing off from injecting your poitical views. I for one was very offended by your TeaParty/taliban remark. You know not of what you speak, let us now leave it at that.

    For the record, I am not the one who coined the phrase “American Taliban”. This is the title of a book by Markos Moulistsas, founder of the American Democratic-supporting political site, DailyKos.com:

    American Taliban: How War, Sex, Sin, and Power Bind Jihadists and the Radical Right [Paperback]
    Markos Moulitsas (Author) ISBN-13: 978-1936227020

    Source: http://www.amazon.com/American-Taliban-Power-Jihadists-Radical/dp/1936227029

    This will be my last word on the subject.

    Reply
  190. C Morgan

    It saddens me to share the news, Harold Star has left the (neighboring) building.): He summed up the current status of Steubenville, with a prediction it/they will never change. An opportunity to right all that is wrong with, has come and gone.
    So I guess those that are handed the power, will continue to rule and oppress the complacent & silent majority?

    [HAROLD STAR:
    March 30th, 2013 at 6:14 am
    This may be an inappropriate blog site to say adieu, but what better time or place to say “He Has Risen” and I am leaving.
    Call it an epiphany or what, but I have realized that nothing further can be accomplished, discussed, dissected or debated regarding the state of affairs surrounding and affecting Steubenville/Jefferson County. I thank Radio for providing me the forum to express my views and, I’m sure, many times offend the guilty.
    I have expressed my thoughts, opinions and criticisms of people, places and things based upon my knowledge of the “movers and shakers” and destroyers of the community. I do not see any “soul searching” or signs of remorse from those that have so wantingly sucked the life blood from the community and who, will continue to do the same themselves, or through their off-spring or surrogates in future generations.
    It is a shame that Steubenville will now be forever synonymous with all that is wrong with society, but that is the path and destiny that the area’s “leaders” have charted for themselves decades ago. They continue to adhere to the “sins of their fathers.”
    And so, to those of you who desire and want change–”stay thirsty my friends.”]

    http://radionewz.net/2013/03/he-has-risen/#comments

    Reply
    1. BooBoo

      I completely agree with Harold Star. Steubenville will remain the same. I think Prin, Anonymous, and all those who stood by them and rallied with them, did an awesome job shining the light of truth and showing the world that there is a rape culture out there that needs to end! This was just a mere stepping stone for all of us. It’s the beginning of the open discussions that need to be had regarding rape and all forms of abuse and violence. Those running Steubenville (and we pretty much know who they are) don’t want the community to change because that would change the power they have over everyone. I don’t believe the Grand Jury is going to do anything in regards to this case. The 3 who should of been charged were handed immunity prior to the probably cause hearing (which was long before Anonymous got involved!!!). Those immunity deals were in place from the get go. You know that, I know that, the world knows that! Just look at how piss poor the investigation was. They allowed at least 1 boy to refuse a DNA test. What did he have to hide if he was so innocent?? Instead, they give him immunity!

      The cards were already dealt long before Prin created the first blog about the case. Prin never claimed to be the one to break the story. Although she was the only one for a long time to have it on her blog giving locals and others a place to discuss the case. For that, MANY people will be grateful! But sadly as Harold Star said,

      “It is a shame that Steubenville will now be forever synonymous with all that is wrong with society”

      Reply
  191. BaronvSteuben

    My thoughts on today’s event’s. Posted on another site earlier today.

    Was driving by the SPD this afternoon. Saw the conga line of law enforcement (2 BCI and I Investigative vans, unmarked car, and a couple of JCSO cruisers) leaving the parking lot. Thought it was a raid on a drug house.

    Very wise to serve the search warrants late in the afternoon. School was in recess; so no children at the high school would be alarmed. Also, easier to seize the evidence without the students and buses present.

    Can’t emphasize how massive this is. A neutral and detached magistrate (here a judge) believed that there was probable cause to believe that the Steubenville School District had evidence of a crime relating to the rape investigation in it’s possession.

    Under the Ohio Rules of Criminal Procedure 41, there needs to be an affidavit presented to a judge to determine probable cause before a judge will sign off on the warrant. Today’s warrant is under seal per the judge. What is in that affidavit that wasn’t available to the AG’s Office on St. Patrick’s Day (the date Mays and Richmond were found delinquent and sentenced to DYS by Judge Lipps)?

    It’s also important to remember:

    1. Just because a search warrant is issued doesn’t mean any evidence of criminal activity will actually be recovered; and

    2. Probable cause to get search warrant signed and executed doesn’t mean
    a.) A crime was necessarily committed; and/or
    b.) That the state can prove anyone guilty beyond a reasonable doubt of any crime that relates to the rape investigation.

    If I was the AD at Bennies or Ursuline; I would be seriously thinking about cutting Steubenville High School a check and walking away from this train wreck after today’s events. It’s one thing to accuse individual students or coaches of criminal activity; but an entire school district? Charges or no charges I would not want my kids to be part of the circus that is going to surround the Big Red football team this fall. This is bad.
    Edit/Delete Message

    Reply
    1. timmeh

      Curious that warrant served on the digital investigation place.

      Random vocabulary word of the week: Spoliation.

      Random case citation: Beaven v. US DOJ.

      Reply
    2. timmeh

      Hey Big Red: Welcome To The Big Leagues. Hope you weren’t using the wrong playbook.

      Reply
  192. Nite_Visitor

    Big Red ( aka Pope Reno ) writes it’s own playbook as they go. What I see happening at the end of all this is that the currently ” incarcerated ” parties will both receive early release for good behavior or some other ungodly reason and be rewarded by the Steubenville Mafia for the rest of their lives for having taken the rap . . . paid tuition to college , maybe a car, job etc. Whatever.
    This is just how I see things going . I truely hope I’m wrong.

    Reply
  193. Alchemist

    @Nite_Visitor

    I don’t think you could be more wrong. They may have ‘taken the rap’ as it were, but neither Trent nor Ma’lik is going to be rewarded for it. Rather, I think they are going to be persona-non-grata in Steubenville for the rest of their lives. If it weren’t for their actions (particularly Trent’s) the town would not be in the position it is now.

    The fallout from that night isn’t over yet — far from it — it remains to be seen what the items seized from Steubenville High School and the Board of Education Offices may reveal. Numerous heads may roll because of this. Even if that were not the case, can you imagine the PR hit the town would take if the convicted rapists were rewarded, as you have outlined? No college (at least worth its salt) would take either of these boys now that they have been convicted of rape. Jobs? Good luck getting a job with a criminal record — the only jobs, by and large, to be had in Steubenville are government positions, and they aren’t going to be handed-out to convicted felons.

    I would argue that their ‘reward’ consisted of being kept out of the adult court system — that’s the be all and end all of it. Most sex-offenders struggle to find a place to live — almost NO ONE wants to rent accommodation to a sex offender. Same goes for jobs, only in this case it’s worse because of the notoriety attached to this case. Employers routinely Google prospective job applicants Google either Trent Mays or Ma’Lik Richmond and their deeds are front and center.

    Reply
  194. C Morgan

    You must not have heard that Hanlin is all for sealing criminal records, if the defendant was young, and made a “youthful mistake” (HSC). So perhaps the Internet may be the only lasting real justice.

    Reply
  195. Nite_Visitor

    @Alchemist
    There are plenty members of the ” Steubenville Mafia Family ” who own businesses that could hire these ( and possibly other ) Big Red Rapist members , just as there are many ways to cover their asses when it comes to sending them to college . After all , where else can 150,000 people demand that a coach be terminated and instead the School Board extends his contract ? We’ll soon see . . . todays the 30th, and the Grand Jury is [B] supposed [/B] to start today.

    Reply
  196. Alchemist

    According to some sources, Hanlin was pushing for both boys to be tried as adults. My understanding from people who seem to know what they’re talking about, is that juvenile records are not automatically expunged/sealed when they become adults, especially in the case of serious crimes like rape. In any case, given the massive publicity, any such moves would be futile.

    Reply
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      It is alleged that two weeks prior to trial Ma’lik offered to cop to a plea of guilty to sexual battery – state said no way, yet there is now growing concern about how much this trial cost the county. Can’t have it both ways, folks.

      Reply
  197. Nite_Visitor

    From WTRF ——
    Ohio BCI agents and Steubenville detectives transported computers, monitors and files to the BCI lab in Youngstown on Wednesday as part of the Grand Jury’s investigation into the Steubenville rape case.

    This is the evidence that was seized two weeks ago when search warrants were executed at the Steubenville Board of Education offices, Steubenville High School and Harding Stadium.

    Detectives say they wanted to transport all of the evidence in one car, so there would be no accusations of evidence tampering. Authorities say everything is secure and on its way to Youngstown
    .
    This allows all the evidence to become “lost” at once , so no one has to decide on what needs to be hidden and what doesn’t.

    Reply
  198. gunnerguy55

    Let us all put this ( RAPE)to the side for just a minute
    And wish all the mothers out there a happy and peaceful Mother’s Day

    Reply
  199. C Morgan
    1. prinnie (Post author)

      Indeed.

      Reply

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